Finally done in Afghanistan?

[ClearedHot]

4 minutes ago, Prozac said:

I think that’s a pipe dream for republicans. But…..2024 isn’t that far away. I count myself as a moderate Democrat who isn’t necessarily opposed to voting R. So who’s gonna run? Trump? Sorry, but that’s as much a no-go for the left as Hillary was for the right. Desantis? Same shit, slightly diluted. Put up a sane, rational, non-octogenarian and you might find a lot of Americans are game. 

I don't want Trump to run again.  I think if the election were held today the DNC would take an ass whipping based on what is happening...and it is going to get worse, a LOT worse.  They just had a Senate Staff call and they accidentally released the number 4100....4100 Americans stranded on the other side of the Taliban checkpoints.  They tried to retract the statement saying it might not be accurate.  If we leave on the 31st and there are American left behind that will be a memory that can outlast even the ADHD of most Americas and the news cycle.  It will most certainly be a landslide at the midterm. 

I live in Florida and support most of what Desantis has done, our economy is booming.  I would like to see a more measured approach to COVID but we will see how it plays out.  At this point I think the GOP ticket will be Desantis and Haley. 

[ClearedHot]

At least our allies still have some stones!  We look like stooges.

Elite SAS troops rescued in dramatic desert operation

[FLEA]

8 hours ago, tac airlifter said:

I've seen a few of your posts saying things like this.  Not sure where you're getting your info, but it's completely wrong.  The entire AFG military folded without a fight when the enemy hit Kabul. 

#Dunkirk

I could be wrong but ive been spending every waking minute for a week now getting families that deserve to be in the gates in the gates.

[pbar]

4 hours ago, VMFA187 said:

Pretty harsh dude, and not entirely on their shoulders. 

Served with an intel officer who was the intel officer for that squadron right before they deployed.  She tried to give a helo vis recce class and was told to get lost.  Another intel NCO I served with was in another squadron at the same base, same time and he told me that all of the other squadron intel shops briefed Army helo ops except that light grey squadron who didn't want to hear it.  

Edited August 25, 2021 by pbar
grammar

[tac airlifter]

1 hour ago, FLEA said:

#Dunkirk

I could be wrong but ive been spending every waking minute for a week now getting families that deserve to be in the gates in the gates.

Not sure what you mean by Dunkirk or what your working evacuation has to do with this, but the ANA folded.  There's no resistance.  Maybe there will be in the future, but for now our investment in this military appears to be a total waste.

[FLEA]

22 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

Not sure what you mean by Dunkirk or what your working evacuation has to do with this, but the ANA folded.  There's no resistance.  Maybe there will be in the future, but for now our investment in this military appears to be a total waste.

Give it a few weeks and some of the stories will percolate down. 

#Dunkirk was the grassroots movement to originally get SOF terps out. Over the week it grew into a massive military/veteran led effort to take the turd that was this withdrawal and save it as much as possible. 

Some of these stories havent spread widely yet because the entire DoD and DoS are in reaction mode and cant even focus on the micro events that happened around this macro event. But it was quite incredible the massive feed of intel a group of random people with military backgrounds was able to generate and validate open source and disseminate in a best effort to get as many people that deserve to be out as possible. 

Edited August 25, 2021 by FLEA

[fire4effect]

5 hours ago, Prozac said:

I think that’s a pipe dream for republicans. But…..2024 isn’t that far away. I count myself as a moderate Democrat who isn’t necessarily opposed to voting R. So who’s gonna run? Trump? Sorry, but that’s as much a no-go for the left as Hillary was for the right. Desantis? Same shit, slightly diluted. Put up a sane, rational, non-octogenarian and you might find a lot of Americans are game. 

At the risk of really derailing the thread I'll put Petraeus' name out there. If they just don't hold that little misdemeanor against him.

Edited August 26, 2021 by fire4effect
clarite

[fire4effect]

2 hours ago, pbar said:

Served with an intel officer who was the intel officer for that squadron right before they deployed.  She tried to give a helo vis recce class and was told to get lost.  Another intel NCO I served with was in another squadron at the same base, same time and he told me that all of the other squadron intel shops briefed Army helo ops except that light grey squadron who didn't want to hear it.  

From my first lesson of marksmanship. Be sure of your target.

[dudebro]

[Danger41]

2 hours ago, fire4effect said:

From my first lesson of marksmanship. Be sure of your target.

Well when your target isn’t where they’re supposed to be in the ATO, they aren’t talking on the appropriate frequencies, the AWACS doesn’t give any help and even negative help, and are flying directly in an area where you’ve been told to kill helos that are killing your allies, it’s not just on the Eagles. Yes, they ultimately pulled the trigger and are therefore responsible, but blaming them solely is completely unfair.

Tragic event that produced lessons for a myriad of communities. And if you think something like that couldn’t happen to you and your community, you’re completely out to lunch.

[AirGuardianC141747]

14 hours ago, SurelySerious said:

Well, their entire economy is based on opium, so they might be ok unless the chinese have undermined that whole thing too.

Makes sense as China has been in the opium game centuries before Afghanistan ever was. Another good vein of opportunity for Big Red. Free WiFi, etc for all, now get back to work and leave the product alone…or get your heads bashed in…

[MD]

1 hour ago, Danger41 said:

Well when your target isn’t where they’re supposed to be in the ATO, they aren’t talking on the appropriate frequencies, the AWACS doesn’t give any help and even negative help, and are flying directly in an area where you’ve been told to kill helos that are killing your allies, it’s not just on the Eagles. Yes, they ultimately pulled the trigger and are therefore responsible, but blaming them solely is completely unfair.

Tragic event that produced lessons for a myriad of communities. And if you think something like that couldn’t happen to you and your community, you’re completely out to lunch.

It’s entirely on the Eagles. From their fucked up VID forward. 
 

Had their been no VID, then maybe include everyone else. Once they went in for the one ID that trumps all others, and fucked it up in both how they did it and and what they came up with, then it became squarely on them. No excuses. At that moment, the other factors just became chaff to try and shift away from the true fault.

The even bigger issue was the salivation to kill two helos that are tooling around in trail doing nothing, no hostile acts, just flying around; even if they were Hinds. Had the desire to kill them instantly, now, been tempered just a bit considering their doing nothing besides flying, there may have been another chance to figure out that they are actually friendlies. The Eagles saw what they wanted to see, and killed what they were dying to kill. And some O-3 taking a nap in an AWACS, would’ve made zero difference at that point.

Edited August 26, 2021 by MD

[Danger41]

43 minutes ago, MD said:

It’s entirely on the Eagles. From their fucked up VID forward. 
 

Had their been no VID, then maybe include everyone else. Once they went in for the one ID that trumps all others, and fucked it up in both how they did it and and what they came up with, then it became squarely on them. No excuses. At that moment, the other factors just became chaff to try and shift away from the true fault.

The even bigger issue was the salivation to kill two helos that are tooling around in trail doing nothing, no hostile acts, just flying around; even if they were Hinds. Had the desire to kill them instantly, now, been tempered just a bit considering their doing nothing besides flying, there may have been another chance to figure out that they are actually friendlies. The Eagles saw what they wanted to see, and killed what they were dying to kill. And some O-3 taking a nap in an AWACS, would’ve made zero difference at that point.

I’d argue that “tooling around” by unknown aircraft without proper modes and codes and in a no fly zone and not on appropriate frequencies pushes into hostile act/hostile intent territory at a minimum. Hell, the VID pass (which they admittedly messed up) was against the ROE they should have been working under anyway to even further complicate it. Reference the comment earlier about not getting the intel on helicopter configurations and paint schemes is a major foul. 
 

This honestly reminds me of one time I had a Gunship guy just shitting all over the B-1 crew that dropped on a friendly CCT and fratted several Army SF in Afghanistan when they didn’t know their pod couldn’t see IR strobes. He derisively laughed and scoffed the B-1 guys and said “we would never do that”. I then asked him how Konduz happened. He had no response. 
 

In the interest of focusing this thread on the here and now of Afghanistan, I’m dropping my arguments on the 1994 Blackhawk shoot down. If the mods want to create a new thread, I’ll gladly go 15 rounds in there.

[MD]

In the interest of thread creep, same. I said my peace, he said his peace. All good. 
 

As the clock ticks down on Kabul, I’m not seeing many options getting out of this cleanly, and I don’t trust the Taliban not to do something stupid, just because of the easy opportunity to do so sitting right in front of them within sight.  Even if it’s action taken un-sanctioned by rogue Taliban elements wanting revenge or any easy kill.

[fire4effect]

Copy that on keeping this on current topic.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwimgJ-t2c7yAhVNl2oFHc23D_QQFnoECBUQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.com%2Fnews%2Fbusiness-58261659&usg=AOvVaw27VPgxpsK7XPtlklDBAf7B

I see close to 10 billion reasons the Taliban will do one of two things. Play nice and let everyone that wants too leave, leave in exchange for the cash OR take hostages for a big fat ransom.

[ClearedHot]

Latest reports say it is even worse at Kabul.  Last night the Dept of State warned all Americans to leave the gate areas immediately due to an imminent threat.  That threat warning was corroborated by multiple other nations early this morning and is ongoing. 

As of this morning they are only letting AMCITs in the gate, NO MORE SIV even if previously approved and a green card issued.  Support agencies have been told ops stop at midnight and military forces will begin their evac to meet the Taliban Aug 31 deadline. 

Canada Govt initially said they would stay past Aug 31 if security allowed, have now decided to leave immediately.  Last Canadian Evac flight leaves in a few hours.

SIV holders have been advised to head for Uzbeck border, Pak border or Panjshir region to link with resistance forces.

[brabus]

This fuckery is unbelievable. The American people better not forget this in the coming few years. 

[ClearedHot]

SVBIED just detonated at Baron Gate - multiple casualties.

 

 

 

[Lawman]

SVBIED just detonated at Baron Gate - multiple casualties.
     

I wonder what Vegas odds are right now on us getting out of this without losing a C17.

I feel like with as much a disaster this has been we are going to see one burning before this is over.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ClearedHot]

Not on the news yet, but they just hit a second gate with suicide vests and now small arms.

*** Edit - And now a third gate.  Appears to be a complex attack on multiple gates. 

*** Edit American casualties...possibly a child.

*** Edit - Confirmed Three American Soldiers injured. 

 

[GrndPndr]

6 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

Not on the news yet, but they just hit a second gate with suicide vests and now small arms.

Geeze... Awful

On a related note, a question:  Does the Taliban making the first move here, free us to operate a little more aggressively?

[ClearedHot]

1 minute ago, GrndPndr said:

Geeze... Awful

On a related note, a question:  Does the Taliban making the first move here, free us to operate a little more aggressively?

It is likely NOT the Taliban.  Despite Joe's lies, ISIS is alive and well in Afghanistan.  Most likely it is ISIS-K (a sworn enemy of the Taliban), taking advantage of the situation to cause chaos.

[ClearedHot]

33 minutes ago, FLEA said:

Second attack at Abby gate. 

And a third at the North gate. 

Also, Italian evac aircraft fire upon during departure.

 

[FLEA]

CH sending you a DM. 

[Herkdrvr]

" As we carry out this departure, we have made it clear to the Taliban: If they attack our personnel or disrupt our operation, the U.S. presence will be swift, and the response will be swift and forceful. We will defend our people with devastating force if necessary."  -- POTUS, 16 Aug 21

Holding breath.

Nah, never mind.  

Edit to add: Agree w/CH this may not be the Taliban, but it sure would be nice to see something other than just take it when we get punched. 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Herkdrvr