COVID-19 (Aka China Virus)

[GKinnear]

So, what's the over-under on when all Summer PCS moves are canceled?

Slight disagreement with Bashi...shit's already retarded

[jazzdude]

So if you live on base and go for a solo run you have to wear a t-shirt or bandanna around your face?
Thankfully I don’t live on base. 

Based on the memo, it seems it's only required for when you can't maintain the 6 feet social distancing. Though CDC is recommending 6 feet plus the mask

[waveshaper]

Here's my go-to COVID-69 mask - it's cheap, works, and manufactured in massive quantities in the PRC/USA. I expect we will see the stockpile vanish in short order, similar to the recent run/hoarding of toilet paper:<)

[drewpey]

1 hour ago, rancormac said:

Masks can actually make things worse....

Reading comprehension is hard.  This is all it takes for someone to not comprehend what they are reading and start spreading stupid shit telling people masks make COVID-19 worse.  If you have a medical mask then sure, it's worse...but for those who don't it's better than nothing.  It's spread through droplets in the air, so while it may not catch all the particles, if it catches any you are likely better off protecting yourself or others with a cloth.  Also it keeps mouth breathers from constantly touching their mouth and spreading germs everywhere.  Wear one of the 50 shemaghs you've been issued, a handkerchief, a homemade mask or that old N95 sitting in your garage for years.  Aircrew as a community immediately pillory anyone for not consulting an expert and making uneducated statements with regards to aviation...yet we constantly see people particularly in this thread turn their nose up at the nation's leading experts  because they think they know better.  It's like a dude trying to convince his fellow airline passengers not to listen to the aircraft commander and ignore the oxygen mask that just fell from the ceiling because his bro once told him sometimes it just happens.  Why question it...it's literally not hurting anyone to put a mask on and hopefully it will end this whole thing 69 seconds earlier.

[brabus]

Don’t cough or sneeze on people, stay home if you’re sick. It’s pretty simple, don’t need to walk around with a mask on for the next year...unless you just can’t handle those easy steps, then by all means slap that maxipad on your face and have fun at the grocery store!

[Homestar]

5 hours ago, kaputt said:

So if you live on base and go for a solo run you have to wear a t-shirt or bandanna around your face?

Thankfully I don’t live on base. 

Only if you can’t maintain six feet of social distance. 

[Prosuper]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/health/coronavirus-blood-donation-guidelines/index.html?fbclid=IwAR21NssVgK_W_KJa3sUIUvAsGbJ4eoyyi8MQ2Tv0v1oaHEW11NK4HDWfvhE.

So all the retired guys on here who were in USAFE in the 80's , if I read this correctly we are no longer disqualified to give blood because of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease or mad cow. I still would call ahead if heading to a blood bank to donate.

[Danger41]

4 hours ago, drewpey said:

Why question it...it's literally not hurting anyone to put a mask on and hopefully it will end this whole thing 69 seconds earlier.

It’s hurting me by making me look like a fucking idiot.

[HU&W]

7 hours ago, rancormac said:

Masks can actually make things worse....

 

https://theweek.com/articles/906647/noble-lie-about-masks-coronavirus-should-never-have-been-told
 

“We must put an end to the idea that the best way to get through this crisis is to say things we know are not true in the hope of getting people to behave a certain way. This means not saying masks are useless when what you really mean is, "Masks are in short supply, please consider before you start hoarding them whether you really need them at present and if so how many."

[FLEA]

1 hour ago, Danger41 said:

It’s hurting me by making me look like a fucking idiot.

Well man, to be fair, at this point in time, you are going to look like an idiot being the person not wearing one. 

Honestly, I could hardly care. Masks were widespread in Asia while stationed there and I got used to wearing one daily in Korea due to the air polution. 

The Bird Flu/SARS/H1N1 outbreaks, all out of Asia forced a cultural change to normalize the wear of sanitary mask on a day to day basis and there is empirical evidence that it has drastically slowed the spread of COVID in those countries. I would predict a similar cultural change will come out of this and to be honest I'm happy about that because I'm tired of sick ass people coming to work and breathing all over the mission planning computers and what not. 

Edited April 6, 2020 by FLEA

[Bigred]

2 hours ago, Prosuper said:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/health/coronavirus-blood-donation-guidelines/index.html?fbclid=IwAR21NssVgK_W_KJa3sUIUvAsGbJ4eoyyi8MQ2Tv0v1oaHEW11NK4HDWfvhE.

So all the retired guys on here who were in USAFE in the 80's , if I read this correctly we are no longer disqualified to give blood because of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease or mad cow. I still would call ahead if heading to a blood bank to donate.

Damn, if I wasn’t on the flight schedule, that was always my go to reason why I couldn’t donate when the mobile blood bank came around (I was born in Europe in early 80s)

 

‘I got the mad cow, yo’

[Jetpilot]

First person to get “chiefed” for inappropriate mask wear in 3, 2, 1...

[BashiChuni]

2 hours ago, FLEA said:

 I would predict a similar cultural change

i would not. wearing a mask isn't going to do a god damn thing besides make senior leaders feel better about "mitigating" the "spread".

[brabus]

8 hours ago, HU&W said:

is, "Masks are in short supply, please consider before you start hoarding them whether you really need them at present and if so how many."

What’s interesting, and makes sense imo, is about a week ago I read on the CDC website a recommendation that while cloth masks will do little to help individuals, it would be good to tell people to wear them so they choose that over hoarding N95, etc. masks. The intent was clear that general mask wear was not a high Pk virus stopper, but rather the masses were going to do it anyways, so let’s at least get them to not waste the masks that healthcare workers desperately need. 

That’s paraphrasing, but that was the message of the recommendation. Fairly smart tactic on their part.

Edited April 6, 2020 by brabus

[jazzdude]

A low Pk virus stopper mask generally is better than doing nothing (unless you never wash the stupid thing, then it's probably going to be worse).

 

Plus a mask is less for protecting you against what's out there, and more to keep whatever you have from spreading to others. Flip side is a respirator (like the N95s) are made to keep stuff out and protect you.

 

So wearing a (cloth) mask in public is more for protecting those around you than for protecting yourself (last resort PPE), and keeping N95 and other respirators free for high risk professionals (medical, first responders, etc) who are in close contact with multiple people who are suspected/known to have the virus.

 

ETA:

"CDC also advises the use of simple cloth face coverings to slow the spread of the virus and help people who may have the virus and do not know it from transmitting it to others."

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/diy-cloth-face-coverings.html

[HU&W]

From what I’ve read, it comes down to droplets vs aerosols.  Both carry the virus. They have different particle sizes.  In general, droplets come out when you talk and aerosols come out when you cough. N95 stops both. Cloth shield only stops droplets because the aerosol particle size is too small. The tighter the cloth weave, the higher percentage of particles it can stop.  

I think I may 3D print a bane mask and put a hepa filter in it. 

[M2]

10 hours ago, Prosuper said:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/health/coronavirus-blood-donation-guidelines/index.html?fbclid=IwAR21NssVgK_W_KJa3sUIUvAsGbJ4eoyyi8MQ2Tv0v1oaHEW11NK4HDWfvhE.

So all the retired guys on here who were in USAFE in the 80's , if I read this correctly we are no longer disqualified to give blood because of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease or mad cow. I still would call ahead if heading to a blood bank to donate.

I heard the same, but I would also call beforehand...

[BashiChuni]

The new reflective belt. 

[Danger41]

Effectiveness of moustaches? My bulletproof moustache continues to bat 1000.

[rancormac]

15 hours ago, drewpey said:

Reading comprehension is hard.  This is all it takes for someone to not comprehend what they are reading and start spreading stupid shit telling people masks make COVID-19 worse.  If you have a medical mask then sure, it's worse...but for those who don't it's better than nothing.  It's spread through droplets in the air, so while it may not catch all the particles, if it catches any you are likely better off protecting yourself or others with a cloth.  Also it keeps mouth breathers from constantly touching their mouth and spreading germs everywhere.  Wear one of the 50 shemaghs you've been issued, a handkerchief, a homemade mask or that old N95 sitting in your garage for years.  Aircrew as a community immediately pillory anyone for not consulting an expert and making uneducated statements with regards to aviation...yet we constantly see people particularly in this thread turn their nose up at the nation's leading experts  because they think they know better.  It's like a dude trying to convince his fellow airline passengers not to listen to the aircraft commander and ignore the oxygen mask that just fell from the ceiling because his bro once told him sometimes it just happens.  Why question it...it's literally not hurting anyone to put a mask on and hopefully it will end this whole thing 69 seconds earlier.

Nice dig. 

The nation's leading experts are recommending the widespread use of masks -- not to protect the wearer from acquiring the virus -- but to help prevent those with the virus from spreading it further.  For example, coughing with a mask on probably reduces the distance of the droplets.  If you're within radius of the droplets though, and have a mask on, it probably wont do shit.  My reading comprehension taught me that cloth mask filtration with virus is almost 0%. 

"Self-contamination through repeated use and improper doffing is possible. For example, a contaminated cloth mask may transfer pathogen from the mask to the bare hands of the wearer. We also showed that filtration was extremely poor (almost 0%) for the cloth masks. Observations during SARS suggested double-masking and other practices increased the risk of infection because of moisture, liquid diffusion and pathogen retention"

 

"In the interest of providing safe, low-cost options in low income countries, there is scope for research into more effectively designed cloth masks, but until such research is carried out, cloth masks should not be recommended."

 

To answer the previous question -- no there was no control vs effectiveness against no mask at all.  So, is throwing a bandana over your face more effective when walking around walmart?  Maybe, maybe not.  If someone with the virus sneezes near you... no, its not going to do shit.  If the virus is on your mask, is it more likely to stay there due to increased moisture retention?  Yes.  If some dumbass with the virus is out in public and wearing a mask, will it slow their infectious rate down? Probably.  Could people walking around with masks now have an increased false sense of security, and start to relax their hygiene and other counter measures?  Maybe. 

[jazzdude]

Guys, it's not hard.

Wash your hands, don't touch your face, stay home if you can. If you have to go out, stay 6 feet away from people/social distance if possible, and wear a mask in order to reduce/slow transmission of the virus. The mask is for those around you, in case you have the virus and are contagious but not yet symptomatic.

Keep your mask clean, change it out when it gets moist. Assume it's dirty when you take it off, so wash your hands. That goes for cloth masks, n95 respirators, surgical masks, bandannas, etc.

If you are sick, stay home.

These are the TTPs we have right now, hopefully we can get more research into it and industry to move on a future solution to enable better TTPs.

[B52gator]

This dude won’t make it through the day.  Calling the commander of the TR “naieve and stupid” to his former crew...what an assclown.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/acting-navy-secretary-ousted-uss-theodore-roosevelt-captain-stupid-naive-coronavirus

 

and here’s the audio he broadcasted to the ship’s crew

https://youtu.be/G7mwlwO0mdM

Edited April 6, 2020 by b52gator

[nsplayr]

https://warontherocks.com/2020/04/the-navys-crisis-of-special-trust-and-confidence/
 

I thought this was an excellent write up of the USS TR incident and how the Navy (mis)handled things. 

[17D_guy]

2 hours ago, rancormac said:

 If some dumbass with the virus is out in public and wearing a mask, will it slow their infectious rate down? Probably.

Great, wear a fucking mask since there's a ton of people who are asymptomatic and don't even know. They're not dumbasses since we can't even get tests to most of the folks with some of the symptoms. 

They wouldn't test any of my Airmen/buddies who didn't have all the symptoms:

One dude had all of them but the fever..."no test, not COVID-19." 
One dude's wife is positive, no test for the rest of the family, they only had fevers and slight cough..."no test, not COVID-19."
Another guy had all the symptoms, not healthcare worker..."no test, not COVID-19."
Buddy in another Sq, all symptoms and had to get carried into the ER, not healthcare worker, "no test, not COVID-19."  He had to have his family carry him to the bathroom he was so exhausted.

More data will become available and we'll adjust.  Acting like something isn't a perfect solution so why try...are you a Col/GO?

This whole thing is the greatest example of "it's not about you" and give a shit about your fellow human being.

[InTheBreak]

1 hour ago, nsplayr said:

https://warontherocks.com/2020/04/the-navys-crisis-of-special-trust-and-confidence/
 

I thought this was an excellent write up of the USS TR incident and how the Navy (mis)handled things. 

Anytime I see any version of the phrase "Lost confidence in his/her ability to lead" it makes me cringe. I think we all know that it's a line for a WIDE range of offenses, unfortunately. I know we don't need to know all the details, but it's just become too much of a catch-all IMHO.