COVID-19 (Aka China Virus)

[Danger41]

The article laid out that he believes that recent statements by officials (Dr Fauci, in this case) reveal that mask wear is not based in science but social pressure. Wearing a mask based on a “lie” is a sin based on his beliefs and his religious beliefs prevent going along with that. If it’s true, I respect him for going with it. If it’s made up and he’s attempting to take advantage of the religious accommodation system to make a political statement, I hope he gets ran out of town on a rail and kicked out.

[Pooter]

1 hour ago, Danger41 said:

The article laid out that he believes that recent statements by officials (Dr Fauci, in this case) reveal that mask wear is not based in science but social pressure. Wearing a mask based on a “lie” is a sin based on his beliefs and his religious beliefs prevent going along with that. If it’s true, I respect him for going with it. If it’s made up and he’s attempting to take advantage of the religious accommodation system to make a political statement, I hope he gets ran out of town on a rail and kicked out.

Sounds like he needs to wear a n-95 or a full blown respirator then.. there's plenty of data supporting the effectiveness of those masks. I wouldn't want him to have to take part in a lie about cloth masks and contradict his "sincerely held religious beliefs" by wearing a nominally effective mask type. 
 

alternatively.. again.. he's a grandstanding asshole

[pawnman]

2 hours ago, Danger41 said:

The article laid out that he believes that recent statements by officials (Dr Fauci, in this case) reveal that mask wear is not based in science but social pressure. Wearing a mask based on a “lie” is a sin based on his beliefs and his religious beliefs prevent going along with that. If it’s true, I respect him for going with it. If it’s made up and he’s attempting to take advantage of the religious accommodation system to make a political statement, I hope he gets ran out of town on a rail and kicked out.

How did he feel about going to Iraq for "WMDs"?

[TheNewGazmo]

Here's a study done in Israel: "Initial report of decreased SARS-CoV-2 viral load after inoculation with the BNT162b2 vaccine" - The results show that infections occurring 12 d or longer after vaccination have significantly reduced viral loads at the time of testing, potentially affecting viral shedding and contagiousness as well as the severity of the disease¹³

^{https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01316-7}

^{If the vaccine does indeed reduce onward transmission 40-60%, that is significant and it's obviously a good assumption that as more people get vaccinated, the less cases we'll eventually see.}

Edited August 13, 2021 by TheNewGazmo

[Guest]

16 hours ago, Pooter said:

Because nowhere in his overly dramatic and verbose memo does he actually cite any part of the Bible from which he is getting these "sincerely held beliefs."  

Literally the entire thing is: "I'm a Christian, I don't want to wear a mask, that is my sincerely held religious belief." 

And the document listing how chaplains concurred with him... is the memo he wrote...  

And nowhere in this memo does he ever address why the mask he has to wear every day to keep him safe in the airplane, is so different in the eyes of god than a cloth face mask.

 

so like I said, grandstanding asshole

I think it is required for the Chaplains to document his sincerely held religious beliefs during their interviews of him, to then forward the documentation through the chain of command. If that's the case, I can see why the Captain's document to his chain of command would list the other information since the DoD/AF policies rest on the Chaplains' documentation of the sincerely held religious beliefs, not the Captain's documentation.

 

16 hours ago, TheNewGazmo said:

16 hours ago, Pooter said:

It's funny how much you can get from reading between the lines of a single memo. Reminds me of some characters I've met at various points in my career.
 
I would bet this dude is a perpetual problem in the squadron and his leadership is very happy he handed them a way to oust him on a velvet pillow by choosing to die on the stupidest hill possible. 

I wonder if his Christianity prevents him from going into MOPP4 as well.

I imagine his sincerely held religious belief of Christianity would not prevent him from MOPP4 due to him not claiming MOPP4 a false narrative. If you read his legal counsel's letter it explains the information more detailed than I repeat here. In one section of the letter, his counsel explains how there are no less than 5 DoD/AF policies that show the Captain's accommodation should be granted. The inconsistencies of the policies' applications during this last approximately 1.5 years are one of the arguments made. Another argument made is that the government (who has the burden of proof, not the Captain) must show a compelling government interest that service-members must be inoculated against their sincerely held religious beliefs. Paraphrasing, as this whole paragraph should be considered as referencing his counsel, they make the claim the lack of deaths/disabilities and continuity of operations during the last approximately 1.5 years fail to meet the government's burden. It really makes compelling argument on the Captain's behalf, and the citation case-law is immensely helpful for further reference.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, pawnman said:

How did he feel about going to Iraq for "WMDs"?

Considering he's a Captain in the current year, he probably wasn't scooting around Iraq in 2003.

[TheNewGazmo]

Another case study about "breakthrough" infections of healthcare workers in Israel:

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2109072?query=recirc_mostViewed_railB_article

Lots of medical jargon, but you'll get the idea if you scroll down to the "Discussion".

Sorry, I edited this a few times....

I'll admit, I am not a huge fan of the idea of getting a piece of metal shoved in my arm and having some "mystery" substance injected into my body.  I've never been a fan of shots since I was a kid.  I am not sure there are many people who actually enjoy the process.  I was fishing with my kid earlier the day of my COVID shot and hooked myself right in the thumb.  It was pretty deep... blood everywhere/lots of cursing involved.  Pulled it out, applied pressure and kept fishing.... I honestly didn't even feel the COVID shot. 

I dodged the anthrax shot for as long as I could and managed to get into the AOR without it a few times (they did get me on the last rodeo, however), but I'm intelligent enough to recognize that the data is the data (which we didn't have and probably will never have for the anthrax series btw so I'm still skeptical on that one...)

I know that vaccinations are essential for a healthy planet.  No matter what your religious belief are, you should be able to recognize that medical research is one of the most invaluable things we have.  There are actually people out there that live and breath this stuff in order to better the health of human-kind and probably have no interest in injecting some sort of locator chip into your body.  Are there side effects to vaccines?  Yes.  There will always be.  There are side effects to Advil and Tylenol (ulcers and liver failure...  still want to take them for your headache?).  Are the side effects rare?  Yes.  I'm on Day 2 since my first poke.  Last night my arm felt about as sore as it would from a Tdap jab and I felt a little more tired than usual, but this morning I feel "normal".  Was this vaccine made quickly?  Under the circumstances, it was, but can we recognize that maybe vaccine technology has advanced to the point where it is possible to make a vaccine in less than a decade?  Isn't that something we ultimately want to combat things like COVID?  When will the next COVID be?  This stuff seems to happen every 10-15 years.  Why must the rate at which we create a vaccine turn into a government conspiracy?

The propensity for anti-vax'ing isn't just associated with COVID.  If you look at the flu vaccine maps, the same states that are low on COVID vaccines are notoriously low for the flu vaccine as well.  I'd imagine it's the case with all vaccines.  Why?  Can anyone explain that one?

Edited August 13, 2021 by TheNewGazmo

[Guest]

I must've missed the CDC's official statement a few weeks ago of it now being a "pandemic of the unvaccinated". Checked this out, it's legitimate. What in the world.

[VMFA187]

Can I get a “Hey!” from my fellow “terrorists?”

 

[Guest]

On 8/14/2021 at 10:55 PM, VMFA187 said:

Can I get a “Hey!” from my fellow “terrorists?”

 

🤣 They're not even going to hide it anymore. The U.S.A.'s federal government is under foreign occupation and the curtains have opened. 

[bennynova]

On 8/14/2021 at 11:55 PM, VMFA187 said:

Can I get a “Hey!” from my fellow “terrorists?”

 

Hey!!

[pawnman]

3 hours ago, dogfish78 said:

🤣 They're not even going to hide it anymore. The U.S.A.'s federal government is under foreign occupation and the curtains have opened. 

Not sure I'm looking to take advice about governance from a traitor. 

[Guardian]

What advice was given?

[VMFA187]

20 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Not sure I'm looking to take advice about governance from a traitor. 

What are your thoughts about what I shared?

[pawnman]

10 minutes ago, VMFA187 said:

What are your thoughts about what I shared?

I think they might be surprised to learn Christmas is a religious holiday. 

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Not sure I'm looking to take advice about governance from a traitor. 

George Washington was a "traitor" to the English Crown. You willing to put your actions to your word and not listen to him about governance too? I don't know where you got "advice" from as @Guardian mentioned. Robert Lee was a respectable and intelligent military leader.

Edited August 16, 2021 by dogfish78

[pawnman]

2 minutes ago, dogfish78 said:

George Washington was a "traitor" to the English Crown. You willing to put your actions to your word and not listen to him about governance too? I don't know where you got "advice" from as @Guardian mentioned. Robert Lee was a respectable and intelligent military leader.

Decent military leader, but not someone I care about when it comes to American government.

George Washington sure was a traitor...to England.  Not to America.  And if I lived in the Confederate States of America and owned some black folks, maybe I'd think Lee was a swell guy.  All I see is someone who fought for the right to own human beings.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Decent military leader, but not someone I care about when it comes to American government.

George Washington sure was a traitor...to England.  Not to America.  And if I lived in the Confederate States of America and owned some black folks, maybe I'd think Lee was a swell guy.  All I see is someone who fought for the right to own human beings.

While my intent is not to argue for or against Lee, his quote on our Federal government having too much power is what I intended to ring home with the post. I imagine you'd agree with that in itself.

[pawnman]

3 minutes ago, dogfish78 said:

While my intent is not to argue for or against Lee, his quote on our Federal government having too much power is what I intended to ring home with the post. I imagine you'd agree with that in itself.

Context is important. Lee is warning about government having the power to free the slaves. 

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Context is important. Lee is warning about government having the power to free the slaves. 

Again, I don't intend to discuss for or against. Merely the quote as it stands about a central power having too MUCH power. The end of the quote references empires before, not related to the U.S. A gun can be used for bad, as it can be used for good. In the context of the quote's meaning alone, it holds weight that an all too powerful central government leads to bad things.

[pawnman]

On 8/16/2021 at 6:22 PM, RedEye1911 said:

Didn't the union states of Delaware, Kentucky, and New Jersey still have slaves throughout the whole war and even after it ended? Strange thing if the war was only about slavery.

Funny how they wrote "state rights" instead of "slavery" on the Confederate Dead Monument in Austin.

State's rights to do...what?

I'll find you some of the articles of secession when I'm at my computer...not even subtle.

Edit: Found a whole list - 

 

Quote

• Richard Thompson Archer (Mississippi planter): "The South is invaded. It is time for all patriots to be united, to be under military organization, to be advancing to the conflict determined to live or die in defence of the God given right to own the African"---letter to the Vicksburg Sun, Dec. 8, 185
• Atlanta Confederacy, 1860: "We regard every man in our midst an enemy to the institutions of the South, who does not boldly declare that he believes African slavery to be a social, moral, and political blessing."
• Lawrence Keitt, Congressman from South Carolina, in a speech to the House on January 25, 1860: "African slavery is the corner-stone of the industrial, social, and political fabric of the South; and whatever wars against it, wars against her very existence. Strike down the institution of African slavery and you reduce the South to depopulation and barbarism." Later in the same speech he said, "The anti-slavery party contend that slavery is wrong in itself, and the Government is a consolidated national democracy. We of the South contend that slavery is right, and that this is a confederate Republic of sovereign States." Taken from a photocopy of the Congressional Globe supplied by Steve Miller.
• Keitt again, this time as delegate to the South Carolina secession convention, during the debates on the state's declaration of causes: "Our people have come to this on the question of slavery. I am willing, in that address to rest it upon that question. I think it is the great central point from which we are now proceeding, and I am not willing to divert the public attention from it." Taken from the Charleston, South Carolina, Courier, dated Dec. 22, 1860. See the Furman documents site for more transcription from these debates. Keitt became a colonel in the Confederate army and was killed at Cold Harbor on June 1, 1864.
• Senator John J. Crittenden, Kentucky (Democrat), March 2, 1861, (Congressional Globe, page 1376); "Mr. President, the cause of this great discontent in the country, the cause of the evils which we now suffer and which we now fear, originates chiefly from questions growing out of the respective rights of the different States and the unfortunate subject of slavery..."
• Henry M. Rector, Governor of Arkansas, March 2, 1861, Arkansas Secession Convention, p. 44 "The area of slavery must be extended correlative with its antagonism, or it will be put speedily in the 'course of ultimate extinction.'....The extension of slavery is the vital point of the whole controversy between the North and the South...Amendments to the federal constitution are urged by some as a panacea for all the ills that beset us. That instrument is amply sufficient as it now stands, for the protection of Southern rights, if it was only enforced. The South wants practical evidence of good faith from the North, not mere paper agreements and compromises. They believe slavery a sin, we do not, and there lies the trouble."
• Thomas F. Goode, Mecklenburg County, Virginia, March 28, 1861, Virginia Secession Convention, vol. II, p. 518, "Sir, the great question which is now uprooting this Government to its foundation---the great question which underlies all our deliberations here, is the question of African slavery..."
• William Grimball to Elizabeth Grimball, Nov. 20, 1860: "A stand must be made for African slavery or it is forever lost." [James McPherson, For Cause and Comrades, p. 20]
• William Nugent to Eleanor Nugent, Sept 7, 1863: "This country without slave labor would be completely worthless. We can only live & exist by that species of labor; and hence I am willing to fight for the last." [James McPherson, For Cause and Comrades, p. 107]
• William M. Thomson to Warner A. Thomson, Feb. 2, 1861: "Better, far better! endure all the horrors of civil war than to see the dusky sons of Ham leading the fair daughters of the South to the altar." [James McPherson, For Cause and Comrades, p. 19]
• George Hamill, March, 1862: "I never want to see the day when a negro is put on an equality with a white person. There is too many free ******s. . . now to suit me, let alone having four millions." [Diary quoted in James McPherson, For Cause and Comrades, p. 109]
• Methodist Rev. John T. Wightman, preaching at Yorkville, South Carolina: "The triumphs of Christianity rest this very hour upon slavery; and slavery depends on the triumphs of the South . . . This war is the servant of slavery." [The Glory of God, the Defence of the South (1861), cited in Eugene Genovese's Consuming Fire (1998).]
• G. T. Yelverton, of Coffee County, Alabama, speaking to the Alabama Secession Convention on January 25, 1861: "The question of Slavery is the rock upon which the Old Government split: it is the cause of secession."
• S. C. Posey, Lauderdale County, Alabama, speaking to the Alabama Secession Convention on Jan. 25, 1861: "Mr. President, the fierce strife we have had with the Northern States, which has led to the disruption of the Government, is a trumpet-tongued answer to this question. They have declared, by the election of Lincoln, “There shall be no more slave territory–no more slave States.” To this the Cotton States have responded by acts of secession and a Southern Confederacy; which is but a solemn declaration of these States, that they will not submit to the Northern idea of restricting slavery to its present limits, and confining it to the slave States."
• John Tyler Morgan, Dallas Cy., Alabama: speaking to the Alabama Secession Convention on January 25, 1861: "The Ordinance of Secession rests, in a great measure, upon our assertion of a right to enslave the African race, or, what amounts to the same thing, to hold them in slavery."
• Jefferson Buford, Barbour County, Alabama, speaking to the Alabama Secession Convention, on March 4, 1861: "Now, Mr. President, I submit that while our commission is of much higher import and dignity, it is, in one respect, by no means so broad. We are sent to protect, not so much property, as white supremacy, and the great political right of internal self-control---but only against one specified and single danger alone, i.e. the danger of Abolition rule."
• Pvt. Thomas Taylor, 6th Ala., to his parents, March 4, 1862: "we are ruined if we do not put forth all our energies & drive back the invaders of our slavery South." (Chandra Manning, What This Cruel War Was Over, p. 66).
• Pvt. Jonathan Doyle, 4th La., to Maggie, May 27, 1863: "We must never despair, for death is preferable to a life spent under the gaulling [sic] yoke of abolition rule." (Chandra Manning, What This Cruel War Was Over, p. 108).
• Alexander Stephens, Vice-President of the Confederacy, referring to the Confederate government: "Its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery . . . is his natural and normal condition." [Augusta, Georgia, Daily Constitutionalist, March 30, 1861.]
• On the formation of black regiments in the Confederate army, by promising the troops their freedom:
  • A North Carolina newspaper editorial: "it is abolition doctrine . . . the very doctrine which the war was commenced to put down." [North Carolina Standard, Jan. 17, 1865; cited in Battle Cry of Freedom, p. 835.]
  • Robert M.T. Hunter, Senator from Virginia, "What did we go to war for, if not to protect our property?"
• Senator William Bigler, Pennsylvania, January 21, 1861: "The fundamental cause of the imperiled condition of the country is the institution of African servitude, ...." [36th Cong., 2nd Sess., Congressional Globe, p. 489]
   
• Alfred P. Aldrich, South Carolina legislator from Barnwell: "If the Republican party with its platform of principles, the main feature of which is the abolition of slavery and, therefore, the destruction of the South, carries the country at the next Presidential election, shall we remain in the Union, or form a separate Confederacy? This is the great, grave issue. It is not who shall be President, it is not which party shall rule --- it is a question of political and social existence." [Steven Channing, Crisis of Fear, pp. 141-142.]
• John C. Pelot, delegate from Alachua County to the Florida secession convention, January 3, 1861: "Gentlemen of the Convention: We meet together under no ordinary circumstances.The rapid spread of Northern fanaticism has endangered our liberties and institutions, and the election of Abraham Lincoln, a wily abolitionist, to the Presidency of the United States, destroys all hope for the future." [Journal of the convention, p. 3]
• John B. Baldwin, Augusta County delegate to the Virginia Secession Convention, March 21, 1861: "I say, then, that viewed from that standpoint, there is but one single subject of complaint which Virginia has to make against the government under which we live; a complaint made by the whole South, and that is on the subject of African slavery...." [Journal of the Virginia Secession Convention, Vol. II, p. 139]
  Baldwin again: "But, sir, the great cause of complaint now is the slavery question, and the questions growing out of it. If there is any other cause of complaint which has been influential in any quarter, to bring about the crisis which is now upon us; if any State or any people have made the troubles growing out of this question, a pretext for agitation instead of a cause of honest complaint, Virginia can have no sympathy whatever, in any such feeling, in any such policy, in any such attempt. It is the slavery question. Is it not so?..." [ibid, p. 140]
• From the diary of James B. Lockney, 28th Wisconsin Infantry, writing near Arkadelphia, Arkansas (10/29/63): "Last night I talked awhile to those men who came in day before yesterday from the S.W. part of the state about 120 miles distant. Many of them wish Slavery abolished & slaves out of the country as they said it was the cause of the War, and the Curse of our Country & the foe of the body of the people--the poor whites. They knew the Slave masters got up the war expressly in the interests of the institution, & with no real cause from the Government or the North."

And from the declarations of secession:

South Carolina - "

“These ends it endeavored to accomplish by a Federal Government, in which each State was recognized as an equal, and had separate control over its own institutions. The right of property in slaves was recognized by giving to free persons distinct political rights, by giving them the right to represent, and burthening them with direct taxes for three-fifths of their slaves; by authorizing the importation of slaves for twenty years; and by stipulating for the rendition of fugitives from labor.

“We affirm that these ends for which this Government was instituted have been defeated, and the Government itself has been made destructive of them by the action of the non-slaveholding States. Those States have assume the right of deciding upon the propriety of our domestic institutions; and have denied the rights of property established in fifteen of the States and recognized by the Constitution; they have denounced as sinful the institution of slavery; they have permitted open establishment among them of societies, whose avowed object is to disturb the peace and to eloign [sic] the property of the citizens of other States. They have encouraged and assisted thousands of our slaves to leave their homes; and those who remain, have been incited by emissaries, books and pictures to servile insurrection."

Mississippi - "“Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery – the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product, which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization. That blow has been long aimed at the institution, and was at the point of reaching its consummation. There was no choice left us but submission to the mandates of abolition, or a dissolution of the Union, whose principles had been subverted to work out our ruin."

Texas - “In all the non-slave-holding States, in violation of that good faith and comity which should exist between entirely distinct nations, the people have formed themselves into a great sectional party, now strong enough in numbers to control the affairs of each of those States, based upon an unnatural feeling of hostility to these Southern States and their beneficent and patriarchal system of African slavery, proclaiming the debasing doctrine of equality of all men, irrespective of race or color – a doctrine at war with nature, in opposition to the experience of mankind, and in violation of the plainest revelations of Divine Law. They demand the abolition of negro slavery throughout the confederacy, the recognition of political equality between the white and negro races, and avow their determination to press on their crusade against us, so long as a negro slave remains in these States."

Virginia - “The people of Virginia in their ratification of the Constitution of the United States of America, adopted by them in convention on the twenty-fifth day of June, in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty-eight, having declared that the powers granted under said Constitution were derived from the people of the United States and might be resumed whensoever the same should be perverted to their injury and oppression, and the Federal Government having perverted said powers not only to the injury of the people of Virginia, but to the oppression of the Southern slave-holding States.”

So again...all about state's rights TO OWN HUMAN BEINGS.

Edited August 18, 2021 by pawnman

[Guest]

2 hours ago, pawnman said:

State's rights to do...what?

I'll find you some of the articles of secession when I'm at my computer...not even subtle.

Not attempting to derail the thread into a U.S. Civil War 1.0 discussion, but to respond to your question the United States' Constitution in 1861, Amendment 10 stated "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." That was the overarching reason leading to the CSA's secession; their secession wasn't something that happened overnight. It was due to decades of having their 10th Amendment right being trampled upon by the federal government. I also suggest you reference the Virginia and Kentucky Resolutions of 1798 for the justification of nullification of illegal federal "laws". It's the same thing we're seeing now with several states passing Second Amendment Preservation Act bills into law; the states/the people are fed up with an out of control federal government.

We can argue back and forth eternally about the morality of some people in the South having slaves, but there were slaves in the north too, during and even AFTER the war as @RedEye1911mentioned. Blacks in Africa were enslaving and selling blacks to Europeans, to which the Europeans brought them to North America and Europe. African blacks are still enslaving each other to this day. Whites were being enslaved by the Ottoman Empire even after the U.S. Civil War was over.

I suggest you listen to some videos of Thomas Sowell. The guy is someone blacks should be listening to, not Soros funded Burn Loot Murder admitted stooges.

Edited August 17, 2021 by dogfish78

[ClearedHot]

Airline Travel Mask Requirement being extended until January.

[BashiChuni]

"it's just two weeks" "it's just a mask"

[HossHarris]

14 days to flatten the curve!