IFF Failure Impact On Hiring Process

[Braves_1995]

I washed out of IFF. I'm flying heavies now and doing just fine. Will my IFF failure affect my hireability with the major airlines or package delivery companies in the future? Anyone have any experience with this situation? Any suggestions on how to approach the topic if it comes up? Thanks. If this is more appropriate for the Road To Wings QnA I'll move it there.

[skibum]

It won't make any difference. If it comes up (unlikely) just say you wanted to travel the world and live like a rock star rather than hang out in a tiny briefing room with a bunch of dudes for six hours for every .69 hours of flying time.

[HuggyU2]

Should be little to no factor for getting hired.  

Lots has been posted on other threads about similar subjects (Q-3, FTU washout, etc...).

Just be honest, and address it with professionalism.  

[hindsight2020]

It will, but not in any way specific to IFF. The airline hiring environment will be much more competitive post-Corona, especially if there are mainline furloughs in the street. In that regard having a training failure in the record is accentuated compared to the same in an environment of more lax hiring.

Meeting an FEB as a result of failing a formal training course after winging does carry a higher penalty than just merely having checkride failures in your FEF. We had a guy in that situation and we were able to get him a re-assignment in lieu-of-FEB and he kept his wings. He was shortly hired by an LCC. 

So it really depends on the hiring environment, and much less on the nature of the failure.

[Braves_1995]

I was given an FEB waiver so never met a board. Not sure if that helps or viewed the same as an FEB where one keeps their wings.

[hindsight2020]

33 minutes ago, Braves_1995 said:

I was given an FEB waiver so never met a board. Not sure if that helps or viewed the same as an FEB where one keeps their wings.

Oh, that helps a lot. It's not a distinction without difference at all. Understand many of the instances where the board meeting would be of interest to the hiring officials is when it involves an incident where the was loss of life and some criminal or administrative culpability would have been pursued. Rare but it happens. In your case (and my ex-coworker's case), nothing is in the record, beyond the Q3s associated with the training failures, if they got to the evaluation stage of the program (which it did for my ex coworker). Getting removed from a formal course with neither failed spot evals nor an FEB, is about as close to walking away scott free as you can get considering the circumstances.

Edited April 30, 2020 by hindsight2020

[Hacker]

I can tell you with high confidence that simply having washed out of IFF is not going to prohibit you from getting hired at the airlines. There are guys flying at the majors with substantially larger black marks on their application than a formal course failure. The airlines are going to take the totality of your experience -- good and bad -- into consideration when deciding to call you in to interview.

That being said, you will be asked about what happened, and you will be expected to own the circumstances and performance that resulted in you being there. Most importantly, they're going to want you to show how you used that negative experience to become a better aviator.

[Pancake]

No factor. Be ready to talk about the lessons you learned from the experience (we all suffer setbacks, it’s important to get back up and keep working towards your goals, empathy to people going through difficult times, etc.). It’s not about your flying performance, it’s about how you handled the aftermath.

If you’re doing well in your current jet, you’ll be fine with respect to getting hired at a major... in two or more years.

Edited April 30, 2020 by Pancake

[Skitzo]

Do the airlines consider a waiver to an FEB the same as an FEB?

I washed out many many moons ago.

Single seat was not for me.

[Hacker]

41 minutes ago, Skitzo said:

Do the airlines consider a waiver to an FEB the same as an FEB?

Both are going to be considered in the context of the rest of your resume....and they will further be evaluated based on how you describe what happened to get you into that situation, and how/why you're a better pilot because of it.

So, the answer is probably no...they're going to be seen differently...but that's because all black marks are going to be assessed individually in the greater context of what you've accomplished.

A "friend" of mine who had been to an FEB was asked in an airline interview if he thought having such a black mark on his record made him less desirable of a candidate for a job offer. He answered that, given the reputation of the quality of candidates for employment at that airline, and that they had their choice of the best of applicants, they probably didn't even need to consider hiring people who had such black marks on their records.

The interviewers began to laugh, and said, "if you only knew what kind of skeletons in the closet guys that fly out on the line for us have", and then proceeded on to the next part of the interview.

The way we look at, and differentiate between, things like the question you're asking from inside the Air Force fishbowl is not the same way it is going to be looked at from outside the fishbowl. Airlines know that for someone to have the aviation experience required to get called for an airline interview, there is a high probability that they've made some mistakes or been involved in something that's not exactly perfect, and they're okay with that. Again, it all depends on what happened, why it happened, and how you have responded/recovered from it.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that my friend in the story was offered a CJO after that interview.

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by Hacker