Banzai Flight

[BashiChuni]

14 hours ago, Danger41 said:

To continue the thread hijack, when guys go through PIT, are you given any instruction/academics on the fundamentals of instruction? Or is it still “fear, sarcasm, and ridicule”?
 

best course at PIT was a ground course called "IP Fundamentals" taught by one of the sim guys (who isn't there anymore). learned a TON about learning theory, etc etc etc.

then walking across the street with IPs who never flew the jet in UPT with real students telling you nothing but "that sucks do better". lol.

fear, sarcasm, ridicule are out and no one that i saw openly taught that.

[Hawg15]

2 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

SNAP

I wasn’t aware that wanting motivated young dudes in the squadron makes you a SNAP. Luckily very few of you old guys who think there’s a benefit to making someone’s life harder for no reason and positive reinforcement makes you a are left in the active duty. These are 21 year olds straight out of college, not WUGs. And somehow all these old ass O-6+ wonder why these kids don’t want to be pilots, especially fighter pilots.

[SurelySerious]

 

Eff it, I can’t read good. 

Edited May 4, 2020 by SurelySerious

[HuggyU2]

5 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

... then walking across the street with IPs who never flew the jet in UPT with real students...

Are you saying there are PIT IP's that have not done a tour as a UPT IP?  If so, that's crazy. 

It was not that way when I was in the 560th (except for a few O-5's and above, I believe).  

[FLEA]

40 minutes ago, HuggyU2 said:

Are you saying there are PIT IP's that have not done a tour as a UPT IP?  If so, that's crazy. 

It was not that way when I was in the 560th (except for a few O-5's and above, I believe).  

I think I've heard the requirements for PIT IP is you must have been an AETC instructor, but any AETC instructor. So an AETC FTU is qualifying for instance. 

 

Edited May 4, 2020 by FLEA

[hindsight2020]

2 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

Are you saying there are PIT IP's that have not done a tour as a UPT IP?  If so, that's crazy. 

It was not that way when I was in the 560th (except for a few O-5's and above, I believe).  

We all agree in principle that there'd be a credibility problem with the direct-to-PIT business. Fortunately it is the exception, at least in 38s. Lots of 2+2s abound, which is better than nothing I suppose.

Also recognize there are many on here for whom the program hasn't, and never will have, any redeeming qualities whatsoever. But that's a sunk cost of working within a demographic of self-important type-As; that's just a Tuesday in pilot land.

Between the time you went through the 560th halls and today, the place has been the recipient of every possible 19th concocted good idea fairy shitshow imaginable, and will be the initial cadre for UPT2.5. Manning demographics in the middle of these constant whipsaws sometimes gets lost in translation. We're all innocent in Shawshank; everybody is trying to make brick, even when the Pharaoh won't send any straw. Just some context. Now back to our regularly programmed sport-kvetching. 😄 

[BashiChuni]

6 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

Are you saying there are PIT IP's that have not done a tour as a UPT IP?  If so, that's crazy. 

It was not that way when I was in the 560th (except for a few O-5's and above, I believe).  

Multiple. 
 

but good points made above irt good idea fairy going wild at RND. 
 

but I’m sure there’s no lack of AD UPT IPs that would go to rnd. RND manning wouldn’t be an issue.  You should def pay dues at a real UPT base in your specific jet before teaching IPs at PIT. That’s just common sense. 

Edited May 5, 2020 by BashiChuni

[LookieRookie]

Clarification for Bashi:

A lot of the 560th is populated with IPs who never taught T-38s in UPT. They were T-6 UPT/UCT IPs and then went to be a T-38 PIT IP later.

[Hacker]

To be fair, the PIT enterprise at RND produces a flying instructor that is orders of magnitude better than what the FAA's CFI-creation process is.

I went to PIT as a salty O-4 who already had more than one IPUG program under my belt, and as @BashiChuni mentioned the "Instructor Fundamentals" academic course taught by the blue-suiters was the first time in my career that the AF had actually made an attempt to teach me how to instruct. It was probably one of the most useful academic courses in my entire AF career.

It wasn't perfect, by any stretch, but it actually codified processes to both platform instruct in the briefing room, as well as gave specific tools on finding root causes and instructional fixes to in-flight performance. It actually explained and put names on a bunch of tools that numerous Patch-wearers and IPs had been trying to explain (but were not actually teaching me) in the process of mashing my balls to mush in hour 13 of the DCA IPUG debrief.

That course at PIT could have actually used a healthy dash of improvement with some of the WIC processes that were vogue out in the ops world at the time (the "perception-decision-execution" method of root cause analysis, for example), but it was good. It is something that *all* new instructors at every level of the training pipeline could really use.

[CharlieHotel47]

used to be Badger flight...

Badgers are alive and well




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[BashiChuni]

3 hours ago, LookieRookie said:

Clarification for Bashi:

A lot of the 560th is populated with IPs who never taught T-38s in UPT. They were T-6 UPT/UCT IPs and then went to be a T-38 PIT IP later.

Thanks!

 

[TreeA10]

Best compliment I've received regarding instructing was a former A-10 IPUGer telling me he learned a lot from most of his IPs but I was the only one that taught him how to teach.  And that was after attending Weapons school.

[Danger41]

Interesting stuff. For those out there that are interested in learning some more of the “how” of instruction, the FAA Aviation Instructor’s Handbook (FAA-H-8083-9A) is very good. If you don’t want to read the whole thing, focus on Ch 1-4 and 7-8. 5 & 6 are kind of OBE due to our V1, V2, and MIF criteria. Chapter 9 is supplanted by ORM processes. 
 

If you have a foreflight account, you can add it for free in the documents section. You can view it for free online as well, but you will have to buy a hard copy.

[SurlySlipper]

Made an account to make a shameless plug. Here's an IP Fundamentals doc for a T-6 squadron made in the spirit of the same IP fundamentals class from PIT but also referencing a few classic and widely-referenced weapon school papers on how to brief and debrief. It was a labor of love and totally open source, free to use/modify/throw spears as anyone sees fit. 

434 IP Guide.docx 434 IP Guide.pdf

[Duane Mayfield]

Last Banzai flight at Vance T38 drop. A-10, F22, F35, F15E, F16. Finished about 6 weeks shy of a year. 

 

[Bender]

The last Banzai students at CBM are going to sit between phase 2 and 3 for about 6 weeks shy of a year.

~Bendy

[dmginc]

2 hours ago, Bender said:

The last Banzai students at CBM are going to sit between phase 2 and 3 for about 6 weeks shy of a year.

~Bendy

Why's that?  Banzai here at KEND wrapped up about 2 weeks ago.

[Bender]

Why's that?  Banzai here at KEND wrapped up about 2 weeks ago.

 

Welp, just a tad bit backed up I guess. This place is Special.

 

We’ll see how they do...went through fast, sit long time.

 

~Bendy

 

Edit: OP, wouldn’t worry about figuring out Banzai...sounds like EVERYONE there will be figuring it out together!

[FLEA]

2 hours ago, Bender said:

Edit: OP, wouldn’t worry about figuring out Banzai...sounds like EVERYONE there will be figuring it out together!

Well. I'm embarrassed. I thought he was legit asking about just another UPT flight. Had no idea of the differences going on in UPT today though. This thread was very insightful so thanks to all who contributed. 

[YoungnDumb]

On 5/12/2020 at 9:42 PM, Duane Mayfield said:

Last Banzai flight at Vance T38 drop. A-10, F22, F35, F15E, F16. Finished about 6 weeks shy of a year. 

 

Are these students guaranteed a fighter for going through the fancy syllabus or did they just luck out?

[CharlieHotel47]

Are these students guaranteed a fighter for going through the fancy syllabus or did they just luck out?

The flight was about 12 studs. There have been guard and reserve bros in Banzai as well. Half of the other bros got Toners


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[Bender]

Are these students guaranteed a fighter for going through the fancy syllabus or did they just luck out?

 

Four of them finished 1-4 in their class per emails I’ve seen out of the 19AF staff; can’t speak intelligently about the fifth.

 

Generated enough “excitement”, that the T-38s are going to start receiving their make over starting at Vance, starting right now.

 

So I guess it’s “lucked out”, as much as you need being 1-4 in your class...

 

~Bendy

[Splash95]

@Jetpower, who informed you about Banzai flight and how soon do you start class? Looking to gather any info I can about UPT at KEND as I have a slot in the class starting 15 July, so others are welcome to chime in here or PM. Thanks!

[Air_Space]

@Splash95 word is all new classes starting in June are going to the Banzai syllabus at Vance. Again that's just a rumor at this point as far as I know. Basically the big difference is there is more emphasis on VR and building good aviators not just getting to the next checkpoint in training. I'm under the old syllabus but my friends really like doing more solos, more advanced flying and being pushed harder. From what I've seen as an outsider, is those that "Got what it takes" do really well and are at least as good, if not better than their "traditional syllabus" peers. Those that struggle fall behind and seem to get left in the dust quicker. PM me if you have any questions about housing or Vance in general