Russian Ukraine shenanigans

[BashiChuni]

On 1/15/2025 at 3:51 PM, ClearedHot said:

Books have been written brother...to very poorly summarize it, Putin wants to restore a vision of what the USSR used to be.  Remember, he started as a KGB guy and most of those dudes are still pissed at how it all turned out.  While many of the old school are nostalgic for a Russia that looks like the old days, I think Putin is a bit more pragmatic and that matches with his actions.  He wants buffer states against NATO, not that he thinks they will invade but the close borders enable nationalism within those former proxies and nothing scares a good communist dictator more than nationalistic hopes for freedom. 

Putin wants to maintain control AND expand his influence and he knows a key component it the economy. 

 

Russia, despite its 23,000 miles of coastline, has no warm water, ice free ports, with direct access to an ocean.  Not only is Russia landlocked, but they lack land where they can grow crops. Russia can be divided into three main areas. The tundra which is 32% of Riussia's land mass, is found north of the Arctic Circle which is WAY too cold for trees and crops.  The subsoil is permanently frozen, sometimes to a depth of several hundred feet.  Then there is the Taiga which represents 1/4 of the worlds forest.  The soil is boggy and is again a huge area of Russia unusable for agriculture.  Finally, the Steppe which is basically a large plain and the only area Russia and grow crops but unlike much of the rest of the world, in that the regions that receive the most rainfall, are the regions with soil least suited to agriculture. Its growing season of 5 – 6 months is also significantly shorter than the 9-month window western Europe has.

The access to deep warm water ports and thus the world's oceans presents SEVERE challenges to Putin.  In the event of war, Russia wouldn’t be able to get out of the Baltic Sea. To get into the North Sea and on into the Atlantic Ocean from St Petersburg, a ship must pass through the Skagerrak, a narrow body of water controlled by NATO members Denmark and Norway.

 

  Then there’s the Black Sea port of Novorossiysk, also home of the Russian Black Sea Fleet.The port however is simply too shallow and too small to facilitate large scale cargo operations. The port is also poorly connected to the Russian heartland, reducing the profit margin of exports, and increasing the cost of imports that come through the port.  Even without conflict Putin's ability to get his goods, energy and resources to market.

 

When you take these factors into consideration and his belief that Ukraine IS Russia his moves make sense.  Taking the Crimea was ALL about access to open water...even with the limitations of getting through the The Turkish Straits, to include the Bosphorus and Dardanelles.  Invading Ukraine proper gives him the bread basket of Europe.  When you look at the calculus of what he has to gain combined with a feckless U.S. administration it makes sense.  His mistake was not realizing 30+ years of Ukraine freedom and nationalism gave Ukrainians a resolve, combined with U.S. weapons and his military leadership being complete stooges he is struggling. 

I am not normally in favor of giant sums of money going to other countries, but in my knuckle-dragger opinion it is money WELL spent to take Russia off the stage for a generation as a hegemonic near-peer.  But hey what do I know, I flew in circles for a living.

 

 

 

 

copy putin wants to maintain his influence in his sphere. kind of like we do.

none of that is a threat to our national security interests. you wrote nothing about putin wanting to keep invading west until he hits the atlantic ocean. crimea has been historically russian. no problem with them taking that.

thankfully trump will find a end to this dumbass involvement we've done. meanwhile the REAL threat to US interests is lurking in the pacific.

[SurelySerious]

copy putin wants to maintain his influence in his sphere. kind of like we do.
none of that is a threat to our national security interests. you wrote nothing about putin wanting to keep invading west until he hits the atlantic ocean. crimea has been historically russian. no problem with them taking that.
thankfully trump will find a end to this dumbass involvement we've done. meanwhile the REAL threat to US interests is lurking in the pacific.

Your reading comprehension sucks.

[Smokin]

Russia is and has been a threat to US interests since 1945 (maybe 1918?).  China is a bigger threat right now, but if you're fighting two guys at once and one falls to a knee, it isn't time to ignore them, it is time to stomp their face so they are out of the fight for a long time allowing you to focus on the other guy.

Is it expensive to fund Ukraine?  Yes.  Are we getting a way better return on that money compared to much of the other junk we burn our national treasure on?  Absolutely.  This is another Russia in Afghanistan scenario except the "good guys" aren't Islamic terrorists.  We'd be foolish to walk away from this opportunity to spend some money and help an enemy bleed themselves out.  Way better to defeat an enemy via a proxy war than face them directly in a war yourself.  And that doesn't even address the good of helping a free people defend themselves.

[BashiChuni]

19 hours ago, SurelySerious said:

Your reading comprehension sucks.

throw facts and show me where i'm wrong. or just throw spears like a child.

[SurelySerious]

throw facts and show me where i'm wrong. or just throw spears like a child.

The facts can only be laid out for you so many times.

[BashiChuni]

yeah ok. my argument is valid and will be proven correct with hindsight. carry on NPC

[ClearedHot]

On 1/20/2025 at 9:28 AM, BashiChuni said:

throw facts and show me where i'm wrong. or just throw spears like a child.

I did throw facts brother, you just read them differently.

[gearhog]

"The Best Money We Ever Spent"

 

Always was a scam. I will never be convinced otherwise.

On 4/22/2024 at 9:15 PM, gearhog said:

I'd think by now people would understand the playbook. It's just routine now.

1. Find a crisis and exacerbate it. If one doesn't exist, create it.

2. Full-court press on the propaganda front to appeal to public fear and garner support.

3. Transfer hundreds of billions of dollars from the public sector to the private sector.

It's like taking candy from a baby and everyone's falling for it. Every. Single. Time. Let's just admit we're completely lost in apathy and gullibility.

Edited Sunday at 11:06 PM by gearhog

[BashiChuni]

BUT BUT BUT ITS GOING TO US DEFENSE COMPANIES!!!!!!! /s

[uhhello]

I understand why there hasn't been any media coverage on that statement but why hasn't the Trump office made any waves on it?  Maybe I missed it but thats a pretty giant admission to make on the record on video and there hasn't been any coverage or pushback that I've seen.

[Swizzle]

45 minutes ago, uhhello said:

I understand why there hasn't been any media coverage on that statement but why hasn't the Trump office made any waves on it?  Maybe I missed it but thats a pretty giant admission to make on the record on video and there hasn't been any coverage or pushback that I've seen.

 

[gearhog]

26 minutes ago, uhhello said:

I understand why there hasn't been any media coverage on that statement but why hasn't the Trump office made any waves on it?  Maybe I missed it but thats a pretty giant admission to make on the record on video and there hasn't been any coverage or pushback that I've seen.

I speculate that this could be one of, if not the, most complex corruption hairballs he's having to deal with. There are so many subplots to this story: USAID funding of the Maidan protests, Victoria Nuland, Biden, Burisma, Biolabs, Nordstream, Pentagon accounting errors, missing funds, theft of military aid, embezzlement, etc. It's going to take a while to ascertain the scope and scale of the fraud and deception. Even then, if it were all to be untangled and exposed, the implications it may have on the economy, foreign relations, global power balance could even give Trump pause for thought.

[gearhog]

Here is why I mentioned USAID and why it is relevant to Ukraine:

- The Ukraine Crisis Media Center was founded in 2014 around the time of Maidan protests. It's an NGO that receives money from other foreign NGOs and governments to advance the interests of other nations in Ukraine, against Russia.

- Who is the biggest contributor to UCMC? USAID

April 2019, Zelensky ran for President promising to fight and expose corruption in the Ukrainian government.

May 2019, the UCMC (the donors above), obviously worried that Zelensky might not be 100% on "Team NeoCon" releases a statement that says

"As civil society activists, we present a list of “red lines not to be crossed”. Should the President cross these red lines, such actions will inevitably lead to political instability in our country and the deterioration of international relations:"

USAID, The Embassy, go on to list in detail all the demands of policies and positions Zelensky must implement, or....

"If the President crosses these red lines, it will indicate that he does not seek real democratic change and does not wish to establish a more honest and responsible government, even though he promised to do so during the election period."

An obvious threat to Zelensky.

It's all here: https://uacrisis.org/en/71966-joint-appeal-of-civil-society-representatives Check out the list of NGOs who signed it, all of which who are funneling (laundering) money.

in 2021,  the "leak" of the Pandora Papers showed Zelensky had funded his campaign in part, and continued to receive funds from his off-shore oil company businesses he had established previous to his election. Leverage.

Later in 2022, Putin invaded, and Zelensky is pressured to advance the demands and interests of these "Non-Governmental" Organizations.

The developments with USAID this week are the tip of the iceberg. Hundreds of Billions of your US dollars are unaccounted for and it's going to take a little while to find it. NGOs are receiving this money and using this money in a way that circumvents the normal US government accounting and audit processes. They don't want you to know how it's being spent.

But... It's hard to hide money from a US government administration that wants to find it.

 

Edited 4 hours ago by gearhog

[BashiChuni]

[BashiChuni]

probably a total coincidence that all of this money influence started to really flow in 2014

and TOTAL coincidence that biden preemptive pardons for his family members and associates is back dated to 2014. nothing to see here!

and, gosh, i can't believe it, but another coincidence that bidens CRACK HEAD son joined the BoD of a UKRANIAN gas company in 2014! wild guys!

Edited 56 minutes ago by BashiChuni

[BashiChuni]

"New Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) said Tuesday that President-elect Donald Trump is “being really dumb” by taking on the intelligence community and its assessments on Russia’s cyber activities.

“Let me tell you, you take on the intelligence community, they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you,” Schumer told MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow.

“So even for a practical, supposedly hard-nosed businessman, he’s being really dumb to do this.”  

-Jan 2017

 

never forget when a sitting US Senator openly said the quiet part out loud. then look at what trump went thru for the next 8 years. He's definitely right over the target.