2023 Active Duty Flying Training Board

[AlexLM12]

9 hours ago, Elaroh said:

Wish they'd provide a board outbrief or something similar.  It'd be immensely beneficial to those wishing to reapply and in mentoring others that want to apply for UFT if they provided a little insight into what influenced selections each year.  Especially what they saw as the key differentiators between selects without PPLs/with scores on the lower end of spectrum from non-selects.

That would be awesome, but I doubt they will provide much insight into their decision process or their algorithm. I got pilot, and am satisfied with that, but if anyone in the future comes across this board and the 215 I posted a few days ago, I'd say that scores and PCSM definitely matter (mine were almost maxed), but there was clearly some other intangibles that factored in. I know some with lower scores than me got ENJPT and I did not, so it definitely is not just the numbers. A lot of Capts, so perhaps rank factored in, and those bullets, strats, and maybe even recommendation letters definitely did. 

[dillonberg92]

That would be awesome, but I doubt they will provide much insight into their decision process or their algorithm. I got pilot, and am satisfied with that, but if anyone in the future comes across this board and the 215 I posted a few days ago, I'd say that scores and PCSM definitely matter (mine were almost maxed), but there was clearly some other intangibles that factored in. I know some with lower scores than me got ENJPT and I did not, so it definitely is not just the numbers. A lot of Capts, so perhaps rank factored in, and those bullets, strats, and maybe even recommendation letters definitely did. 

You just named everything

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

[AlexLM12]

1 minute ago, dillonberg92 said:

You just named everything

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
 

I mean, obviously everything matters to some degree, but I meant that reviewing the stats from the board does not tell the whole story, when some of the most competitive things went to those with scores that were not as high as others selected for different things. My scores were high like I posted, but that's not enough on its own to get in

[nonflyboy]

It’s a lot of everything. The person that got a UPT slot with a 34 PCSM was DG from commissioning source, DG at tech school and rated #1 Lt at the wing. So scores aren’t end all be all

Edited January 25, 2023 by nonflyboy
Grammar

[BeerForMyHorses]

13 hours ago, Elaroh said:

Wish they'd provide a board outbrief or something similar.  It'd be immensely beneficial to those wishing to reapply and in mentoring others that want to apply for UFT if they provided a little insight into what influenced selections each year.  Especially what they saw as the key differentiators between selects without PPLs/with scores on the lower end of spectrum from non-selects.

 

3 hours ago, AlexLM12 said:

That would be awesome, but I doubt they will provide much insight into their decision process or their algorithm. I got pilot, and am satisfied with that, but if anyone in the future comes across this board and the 215 I posted a few days ago, I'd say that scores and PCSM definitely matter (mine were almost maxed), but there was clearly some other intangibles that factored in. I know some with lower scores than me got ENJPT and I did not, so it definitely is not just the numbers. A lot of Capts, so perhaps rank factored in, and those bullets, strats, and maybe even recommendation letters definitely did. 

 

1 hour ago, nonflyboy said:

It’s a lot of everything. The person that got a UPT slot with a 34 PCSM was DG from commissioning source, DG at tech school and rated #1 Lt at the wing. So scores aren’t end all be all

I'll add my $0.02 to this discussion, as  someone that was confused why I'm an alternate but 2 others from my wing were selected. You can look at my comment history in this thread for more details but short story: I had better scores and numbers, stratted  higher from the wing, and had a Wg/CC sign my letter of rec. I'm an alternate but they were selected. The other 2 from the wing had objectively worse applications in every measurable way. Emphasis on objectively. 

So I emailed the board. I asked about the alternate process and as an after thought at the end of the email, I asked "how I can improve my application for next year's board, specifically anything subjective they noticed". (I didn't complain about the above situation, I knew that wouldn't look good). They replied explaining the board uses an algorithm to help quantify subjective packages. Only 30% of your score comes from PCSM, AFOQT, college GPA, etc. I don't remember what the other 30% and 40% was exactly, but one of them is leadership and experience. They said really good test scores don't mean as much for an otherwise average application. They made sure to tell me my application was above average but this board was very competitive and my chances of being selected next year are good. It helped to read that last bit but still stung haha.

This coincided with the feedback I received from my Gp/CC. The other 2 from the wing are the same AFSC but have been doing it longer than me. So by default, by doing the job longer, they have had more leadership opportunities and experience to present to the board. Also, their scores were decent too. I've had a  bright start to my career, but I'm "young".

Anyways, if I've interpreted all of this feedback correctly, what you've done in your career and how well you communicate it to the board is just as important, if not more important, than every number on the AF215 combined. I definitely know how to improve that for next year. Food for thought. 

Edit: incase it wasn't clear. The things the board probably are looking closely at is the personal letter, letter of recommendation, the 3 bullets from your rater and 3 bullets from your senior rater. Specifically how robust they are. They can tell if it's a bunch of fluff or something meaningful. All of the test scores, PCSM, etc are likely just checking a box for the board. 

[nonflyboy]

9 hours ago, goboldtigers said:

 

 

I'll add my $0.02 to this discussion, as  someone that was confused why I'm an alternate but 2 others from my wing were selected. You can look at my comment history in this thread for more details but short story: I had better scores and numbers, stratted  higher from the wing, and had a Wg/CC sign my letter of rec. I'm an alternate but they were selected. The other 2 from the wing had objectively worse applications in every measurable way. Emphasis on objectively. 

So I emailed the board. I asked about the alternate process and as an after thought at the end of the email, I asked "how I can improve my application for next year's board, specifically anything subjective they noticed". (I didn't complain about the above situation, I knew that wouldn't look good). They replied explaining the board uses an algorithm to help quantify subjective packages. Only 30% of your score comes from PCSM, AFOQT, college GPA, etc. I don't remember what the other 30% and 40% was exactly, but one of them is leadership and experience. They said really good test scores don't mean as much for an otherwise average application. They made sure to tell me my application was above average but this board was very competitive and my chances of being selected next year are good. It helped to read that last bit but still stung haha.

This coincided with the feedback I received from my Gp/CC. The other 2 from the wing are the same AFSC but have been doing it longer than me. So by default, by doing the job longer, they have had more leadership opportunities and experience to present to the board. Also, their scores were decent too. I've had a  bright start to my career, but I'm "young".

Anyways, if I've interpreted all of this feedback correctly, what you've done in your career and how well you communicate it to the board is just as important, if not more important, than every number on the AF215 combined. I definitely know how to improve that for next year. Food for thought. 

Edit: incase it wasn't clear. The things the board probably are looking closely at is the personal letter, letter of recommendation, the 3 bullets from your rater and 3 bullets from your senior rater. Specifically how robust they are. They can tell if it's a bunch of fluff or something meaningful. All of the test scores, PCSM, etc are likely just checking a box for the board. 

Well said boss

[Arkbird]

21 hours ago, goboldtigers said:

 

 

I'll add my $0.02 to this discussion, as  someone that was confused why I'm an alternate but 2 others from my wing were selected. You can look at my comment history in this thread for more details but short story: I had better scores and numbers, stratted  higher from the wing, and had a Wg/CC sign my letter of rec. I'm an alternate but they were selected. The other 2 from the wing had objectively worse applications in every measurable way. Emphasis on objectively. 

So I emailed the board. I asked about the alternate process and as an after thought at the end of the email, I asked "how I can improve my application for next year's board, specifically anything subjective they noticed". (I didn't complain about the above situation, I knew that wouldn't look good). They replied explaining the board uses an algorithm to help quantify subjective packages. Only 30% of your score comes from PCSM, AFOQT, college GPA, etc. I don't remember what the other 30% and 40% was exactly, but one of them is leadership and experience. They said really good test scores don't mean as much for an otherwise average application. They made sure to tell me my application was above average but this board was very competitive and my chances of being selected next year are good. It helped to read that last bit but still stung haha.

This coincided with the feedback I received from my Gp/CC. The other 2 from the wing are the same AFSC but have been doing it longer than me. So by default, by doing the job longer, they have had more leadership opportunities and experience to present to the board. Also, their scores were decent too. I've had a  bright start to my career, but I'm "young".

Anyways, if I've interpreted all of this feedback correctly, what you've done in your career and how well you communicate it to the board is just as important, if not more important, than every number on the AF215 combined. I definitely know how to improve that for next year. Food for thought. 

Edit: incase it wasn't clear. The things the board probably are looking closely at is the personal letter, letter of recommendation, the 3 bullets from your rater and 3 bullets from your senior rater. Specifically how robust they are. They can tell if it's a bunch of fluff or something meaningful. All of the test scores, PCSM, etc are likely just checking a box for the board. 

I agree. I was selected on last year's board and I've had a few friends tell me they know guys with "better" packages than mine not get selected. Better in their minds were higher scores and PPLs. I told them I'm sure those help but scores aren't everything. Maybe I had better bullets, a better personal letter, or a better LoR. I was doing things that affected every Air Force MQ-9 but my peers seemed to think the scores mattered most. I was 5/6 in my wing and 3/3 in the squadron (I had been there the least amount of time) and I still got picked up even though our #1 strat for the wing didn't. 

Point of this isn't to brag but to say focusing on the job and really making those big impacts with your job or leadership really affect your board scores and ranking.

[Bama]

Has anyone ever heard of someone declining a pilot slot?

[Elaroh]

4 hours ago, Bama said:

Has anyone ever heard of someone declining a pilot slot?

I haven't personally heard of someone declining UPT in the 7-day opt out window.  Just folks that decide it's not for them halfway through training.

I'm sure it happens occasionally though.

[Ganderly8]

6 hours ago, Bama said:

Has anyone ever heard of someone declining a pilot slot?

A dude in my squadron said he declined a pilot slot because he wanted ABM instead

[nolifepilot]

Have any other selects been notified by MPF or FSS? My interpretation of the PDSM is that we should have gotten some sort of notification from them but no one in my wing has heard anything.

 

Also, do they take more than 1 person per squadron? Looking at the names lists for the past 2 years there aren't any repeated squadrons and so we've been wondering if there's a limit of only 1 person per sqdn. Out of our 4 sqdn applicants, only 2 of us got picked up, but the other guy moved from my sqdn to the OSS right around when the board was meeting and he shows on the selection PDSM as being a part of the OSS, not the squadron that we both were in when we applied.

[Jam]

26 minutes ago, nolifepilot said:

Have any other selects been notified by MPF or FSS? My interpretation of the PDSM is that we should have gotten some sort of notification from them but no one in my wing has heard anything.

 

Also, do they take more than 1 person per squadron? Looking at the names lists for the past 2 years there aren't any repeated squadrons and so we've been wondering if there's a limit of only 1 person per sqdn. Out of our 4 sqdn applicants, only 2 of us got picked up, but the other guy moved from my sqdn to the OSS right around when the board was meeting and he shows on the selection PDSM as being a part of the OSS, not the squadron that we both were in when we applied.

I don’t think they notify us. My interpretation was that if we’re accepting the slot we don’t have to do anything and we’ll just have to wait for our MFS/IFT/PCS stuff. 
 

Also don’t think there’s a limit per squadron. Looking at the PSDM there’s some people from the same that got picked up.

Hopefully assignments come out soon!

[Elaroh]

20 minutes ago, nolifepilot said:

Have any other selects been notified by MPF or FSS? My interpretation of the PDSM is that we should have gotten some sort of notification from them but no one in my wing has heard anything.

 

Also, do they take more than 1 person per squadron? Looking at the names lists for the past 2 years there aren't any repeated squadrons and so we've been wondering if there's a limit of only 1 person per sqdn. Out of our 4 sqdn applicants, only 2 of us got picked up, but the other guy moved from my sqdn to the OSS right around when the board was meeting and he shows on the selection PDSM as being a part of the OSS, not the squadron that we both were in when we applied.

Nothing from MPF or FSS yet.  Last day to decline with AFPC was 24 Jan, so it's probably just going to take some time for RIPs to flow through AFPC and MPF.

 

I'd be very surprised if they had an artificial limit capping number of selects per squadron.  Also, that's odd that the member showed up as their old Sq.  I PCS'd about the same time as the board and showed up under my new unit.

[cheraypaja]

Just got my assignment notification from my CC. Headed to Columbus in May, was not expecting it to be so soon! No RIPS with a class date yet however.

[O Face]

On 1/26/2023 at 12:28 PM, Ganderly8 said:

A dude in my squadron said he declined a pilot slot because he wanted ABM instead

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by O Face

[Flyinghobbit]

4 hours ago, cheraypaja said:

Just got my assignment notification from my CC. Headed to Columbus in May, was not expecting it to be so soon! No RIPS with a class date yet however.

Oh dang! Do you already have your ppl? 

[nolifepilot]

4 hours ago, cheraypaja said:

Just got my assignment notification from my CC. Headed to Columbus in May, was not expecting it to be so soon! No RIPS with a class date yet however.

Ayyyy congrats!! That's wayyyyyyyyyyy sooner than anyone expected! 

[nolifepilot]

Just used the EFMP trick to find out I'm headed to Columbus!! Not sure of dates yet though.

EFMP Trick (from @Arkbird last year)

- Log into vMPF and click under self-service actions
- Click on Assignments (while in self-service) and go down to the EFMP section
- In the new tab, click on the "apply to change/cancel assignment
- If this doesn't kick back with "MILPDS doesn't reflect an assignment loaded, click on next and choose any of the options then next again. This next screen will tell you what unit and base you will be going to.

[cheraypaja]

10 hours ago, Flyinghobbit said:

Oh dang! Do you already have your ppl? 

Yes, so no IFT for me, probably why its earlier in the year.

[Flyinghobbit]

9 hours ago, nolifepilot said:

Just used the EFMP trick to find out I'm headed to Columbus!! Not sure of dates yet though.

EFMP Trick (from @Arkbird last year)

- Log into vMPF and click under self-service actions
- Click on Assignments (while in self-service) and go down to the EFMP section
- In the new tab, click on the "apply to change/cancel assignment
- If this doesn't kick back with "MILPDS doesn't reflect an assignment loaded, click on next and choose any of the options then next again. This next screen will tell you what unit and base you will be going to.

Looks like mine just says the assignment I would have gone to had i not been selected for pilot! 

Do you have your ppl? 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Flyinghobbit

[nolifepilot]

40 minutes ago, Flyinghobbit said:

Looks like mine just says the assignment I would have gone to had i not been selected for pilot! 

Do you have your ppl? 

Yessir! I've got my PPL and I'm also already rated so I don't have to go to either IFT or MFS.

[Flyinghobbit]

53 minutes ago, nolifepilot said:

Yessir! I've got my PPL and I'm also already rated so I don't have to go to either IFT or MFS.

I thought everyone needed MFS...I'm rated too. MFS being in wright pat and required for all pilots?

Edited January 28, 2023 by Flyinghobbit

[nolifepilot]

4 hours ago, Flyinghobbit said:

I thought everyone needed MFS...I'm rated too. MFS being in wright pat and required for all pilots?

Check your 2808, the stamp will either say "Medically Qualified for FC1 pending MFS" or "Medically Qualified for FC1." You'll only need to attend MFS if it's the former, otherwise you're cleared hot! It depends on where you did your initial flight physical too - if you did it at either USAFA or Wright-Patt then you won't need to attend MFS, but if you got it done anywhere else then you'll need to attend MFS to be fully cleared for FC1. I got mine done at USAFA in 2016, got DQ'd there in 2018, then redid my FC1 locally at my base (Grand Forks AFB) in 2022. When I did my FC1 physical here, the flight doc said that I'd only need to go to Wright Patt if they needed more info about my waiver, otherwise I'd be good to go. My 2808 stamp says "Medically Cleared for: FC1 (w/waiver), FC1A (w/waiver)."

[nolifepilot]

Got my dates this morning, RNLTD of 6 May to Columbus!

[FlyingHog]

I know there were a few selects on here who stated they were turning down ABM, CSO, and RPA. Curious as to if anyone has been contacted as an alternate yet.

Edited January 30, 2023 by FlyingHog