World War III Updates

[Danger41]

This whole situation is terrible obviously, but I personally am having a very difficult time finding a lot of sympathy for Gaza at this point. They elected Hamas a decade and a half ago to be their representative government. Their goals and methods have been consistent for way longer than that. Look at the Hamas charter if you're curious about what they're really pursuing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas_Charter)

 

Something something reap what you sow.

[Danger41]

51 minutes ago, gearhog said:

Infuriating. White House spokesperson John Kirby cries like little bitch.

This is the face of our nation when confronted with chaos, conflict, and evil? What an embarrassment.

https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1711827979784122690?s=20

Seeing videos of babies getting murdered and kids getting burned alive can have an affect on people. Myself included. I don't think showing humanity in the face of that is the worst thing in the world.

 

[fire4effect]

Unfortunately, evil still exists. Painful as it is it's now harder to hide. 

[ClearedHot]

I am appalled by the report I just saw, as Israeli forces have liberated a village overrun by Hamas they discovered babies that were beheaded by Hamas terrorists.  Kill them all.

[McJay Pilot]

29 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

 Kill them all.

Harrumph.

[brabus]

Honestly I’m glad so much of this barbaric shit is now readily available on Twitter, etc. Nothing that has happened in Israel is new to the world, it’s just the average 1st world civilian actually has seen it/heard it described in detail for the first time. Maybe this will actually wake up all the latte-sipping meat bags that evil is in fact real, it’s everywhere, and we should actually do something about it.

Kill everyone in Gaza, destroy all infrastructure. If the civilians haven’t left after the more than ample warning, fuck ‘em. Zero sympathy.

Edited October 11, 2023 by brabus

[Boomer6]

I remember watching a young civilian truck driver getting his head sawed off in Iraq by some haji with what appeared to be a semi-dull knife when I was a young punk. If I could have enlisted at that age I would have. I get the rage at the atrocities that have occurred.

However, I don’t understand some of the comments regarding civilians in Gaza. Based on some quick googling, elections were last held in 2006, and Abbas has delayed new ones for the last 17 years. Egypt has also blockaded Gaza since 2007. My knowledge is limited here, so I’m happy to be educated if required. However, if the above is true, where the fuck are these civilians going to “get out to”?I guess they could start swimming.

An entire generation has grown up with zero input into who controls where they live, and since the average age is ~18 years old, I have a hard time blaming them for elections in 2006.

I’m not saying Israel shouldn’t go on a haji hunting spree, but I absolutely have sympathy for the innocent civilians that will be caught up in this with nowhere to run.

[brabus]

You’re right there are some “innocents” there who will die, and that does suck. But the only long game move for Israel, for literal survival of their country, is to go scorched earth. A place like Gaza is not comprised of very many “innocent” people, children included (it’s not their fault they were raised to be evil POS humans, but they are still in fact, evil POS humans).

[HeloDude]

1 hour ago, brabus said:

Kill everyone in Gaza, destroy all infrastructure. If the civilians haven’t left after the more than ample warning, fuck ‘em. Zero sympathy.

While I’m understanding of your emotions, somehow I don’t think that would really make things better.  I don’t know what the overall best solution is, but it’s definitely not this.  Those that would stay behind would not necessarily remain there because they want to.

Go after the terrorists, attempt to kill each and every last one…do your best to limit innocent casualties.  And that’s even much easier said than done.

I’m really curious to see how this all ends…but it’s definitely not going to be pretty.

[brabus]

59 minutes ago, HeloDude said:

Go after the terrorists, attempt to kill each and every last one…do your best to limit innocent casualties

Sure, that’s great. They should do their best, but given the existential threat to their survival, and the fact they were attacked horribly in their own beds, it’s not prudent to just play whack-a-mole. They need to eradicate Hamas AND their sympathizers to have any real chance at a more stable and secure future. Handing a little slice of ass and then walking away isn’t going to cut it. History has repeatedly demonstrated that. Hezbollah, Iran, etc. are all watching - the message they receive is also very important for Israel’s future.

[Danger41]

1 hour ago, Boomer6 said:

I remember watching a young civilian truck driver getting his head sawed off in Iraq by some haji with what appeared to be a semi-dull knife when I was a young punk. If I could have enlisted at that age I would have. I get the rage at the atrocities that have occurred.

However, I don’t understand some of the comments regarding civilians in Gaza. Based on some quick googling, elections were last held in 2006, and Abbas has delayed new ones for the last 17 years. Egypt has also blockaded Gaza since 2007. My knowledge is limited here, so I’m happy to be educated if required. However, if the above is true, where the fuck are these civilians going to “get out to”?I guess they could start swimming.

An entire generation has grown up with zero input into who controls where they live, and since the average age is ~18 years old, I have a hard time blaming them for elections in 2006.

I’m not saying Israel shouldn’t go on a haji hunting spree, but I absolutely have sympathy for the innocent civilians that will be caught up in this with nowhere to run.

All valid points but my thought is if you’re dealt a shit hand, do something about it. Same thing applied to Afghanistan. All these young men that are poor helpless victims that do nothing to improve their situation don’t get much sympathy from me. My depression era grandfather fought in WW2 with no high school education and died after building a million dollar business and raising a family. He also was part Lakota Sioux who looked like Sitting Bull. Definitely didn’t help much in South Dakota. Having said that, I won’t pretend that a dude with brown skin in post WW2 America had it harder than kids in Gaza.
 

Hell, look at what Israel did from the literal first day of existing as a country (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab–Israeli_War). They’ve fought for it against the surrounding Arab countries. In my mind, if Hamas views what they’re doing in the same light as fighting a war against Israel, then they can get wrecked again. If their chosen tactics are what have been displayed, they don’t deserve anything but to be exterminated.
 

If they want to improve their lives, then join the 21st century, stop letting Iran treat you as a sacrificial lamb and puppet, and adopt some of this love and peace I keep hearing all these people tell me Islam is all about. 

[gearhog]

12 hours ago, Danger41 said:

Seeing videos of babies getting murdered and kids getting burned alive can have an affect on people. Myself included. I don't think showing humanity in the face of that is the worst thing in the world.

Yeah, it's bad. I try to remain stoic while attempting to get the facts and assess the situation, but this is some horrific stuff. This attack was designed to provoke an emotional response, and it certainly worked on me. I can't imagine being close to the event. But could there be anything more satisfying to this evil than seeing the leadership of the most powerful nation in the world openly weeping on live TV? Somewhere on our path to modern Western society, it became tolerable for full grown men to lose their composure and put their weakness on full display when representing a superpower during a 60 second news segment. Process your grief elsewhere, then man up and demonstrate that we are a nation of strength, not weakness, and give the public faith that we can make sound rational decisions during dangerous times.

It's like looking over at the other cockpit and seeing your lead crying just before you launch a night tac LL formation airdrop in mountainous terrain. WTF?

Kirby crying may not be a huge deal in itself, but it affirms my suspicions that this administration is going to fuck this up as bad as everything else in the last 3 years.

Edited October 11, 2023 by gearhog

[ClearedHot]

9 hours ago, Boomer6 said:

I remember watching a young civilian truck driver getting his head sawed off in Iraq by some haji with what appeared to be a semi-dull knife when I was a young punk. If I could have enlisted at that age I would have. I get the rage at the atrocities that have occurred.

However, I don’t understand some of the comments regarding civilians in Gaza. Based on some quick googling, elections were last held in 2006, and Abbas has delayed new ones for the last 17 years. Egypt has also blockaded Gaza since 2007. My knowledge is limited here, so I’m happy to be educated if required. However, if the above is true, where the fuck are these civilians going to “get out to”?I guess they could start swimming.

An entire generation has grown up with zero input into who controls where they live, and since the average age is ~18 years old, I have a hard time blaming them for elections in 2006.

I’m not saying Israel shouldn’t go on a haji hunting spree, but I absolutely have sympathy for the innocent civilians that will be caught up in this with nowhere to run.

You have some valid points and I will ALWAYS have sympathy and concern for innocent civilians.  When I say kill them all I am obviously talking about the terrorists not the Palestinians in general.  Israel is far from perfect in this situation and much has been made of the conditions in Gaza but cutting off the heads of babies is a completely different realm and drastic actions have to take place.

The "where do they go" question does not have an easy answer, at first Egypt opened their border but as of the morning they have moved to restrict the flow of evacuation fearing a mass exodus that would lay a massive humanitarian crisis at their feet.  If Israel intends to completely destroy Hamas they will likely completely destroy Gaza.

The other big question is what about Iran?  Will we turn another blind eye?  Will we be able to restrain Israel?

 

 

[fire4effect]

21 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

Will we be able to restrain Israel?

 

 

As my grandfather once said that is the $64000 dollar question. With the rage in Israel 0 F**** are given on what the rest of the world thinks including the US at this point. I'm afraid that if/when even a shred of evidence ties this back to Tehran it will be game on. I think Israel has already captured one reasonably high-ranking Hamas commander and I'm sure the conversation isn't very pretty.

[tac airlifter]

42 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

When I say kill them all I am obviously talking about the terrorists not the Palestinians in general. 

The "where do they go" question does not have an easy answer

The other big question is what about Iran?  Will we turn another blind eye? 

Great post.  Top line quoted for truth; I too, have said "kill them all" but assume mature people know that statement applies to combatants not civilians. But it's worth mentioning, as it is a key distinction between our side and theirs.  Radical jihadists mean "kill them all" in the genocidal sense.  That said, the definition of 'combatant' must be revised for wars against unconventional forces hiding behind civilians and collateral damage is inevitable.... the blame lies on Hamas for that result.

I have no idea where an average Gaza resident is supposed to go.  Not to be harsh, but don't elect Hamas if you don't want to be in this position.  I realize their choice at the ballot box was an illusion as Hamas had the guns and wouldn't allow true opposition.  Unfortunate situation with no easy answer.  Hamas is willing to let every Palestinian child die... I hope it doesn't come to that but how do you fight an adversary bent on genocide without eradicating them?  
 

As for Iran, a few days ago I was incorrectly hung up on the Sunni/shia divide and didn't realize how close the collaboration already was.  Hamas is proud of the Iranian support; wow.  I'm out of my depth, but I do think for the US part we won't do anything.  Could be wrong, but I'd guess we lack the appetite to hold Iran directly accountable for US deaths.

[Lord Ratner]

At least half of the innocent civilians support Hamas. More than that support the destruction of Israel in exactly the manner that Hamas attempted this week.

 

I don't think sparing the civilian population is as obvious as some are acting. Actively wipe out "innocents?" Probably not. But intentionally wipe out everything they need to survive in Gaza to force their expulsion into the rest of the Arab world? Probably. Ignore the collateral risk if you have a legitimate target to hit? Also probably.

 

This is exactly the type of attack Israel can expect now that it succeeded, if they return to the status quo. 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Lord Ratner

[NKAWTG]

Gaza needs to cease to exist as an entity after this.  Destroy every building, collapse every tunnel.  As to the people there, give them an outlet or two in Egypt and the Mediterranean to flee too.  Let the virtue signalers in Europe accept a few more Muslim refugees. 

The disproportional response is required, and honestly, that is what Iran was aiming for all along.  This prevents Saudi and Israel from coming to any sort of diplomatic terms.  Qatar and UAE will be hard pressed to continue relations when the Israeli's send the entire Palestinian people in to exile.  Not that anyone cares about the Palestinians, but they would rather it be Israel's problem instead of their own. 

       

[ecugringo]

From what I understand on the Palestinians is that nobody wants them...Egypt, Jordan, Syria etc....They are all happy to keep then where they are and finance them to be assholes with Israel.  I read the original idea of Gaza was to make it a mid east version of Singapore.  Small micro country with the best coastal tourist spots and be a vibrant micro nation....They apparently weren't interested in that and somewhere along the line became more interested in the destruction of Israel.

I do believe Russia is involved with this to make a distraction from Ukraine.

An interesting play for the US would be to salvage Israel/Saudi relations...Sell arms to Saudi and turn a blind eye to what they do in Yeman vs the Iranian backed rebels.

I do find the pro Palestinian demonstration across the world very disturbing.  Even if you dont like the Israeli state....celebrating this is pretty disgusting.  

[gearhog]

The Gerald Ford Carrier Battle Group is currently off the Israeli coast.

Obviously, "deterrence" requires two.

"The U.S. may deploy a second aircraft carrier near Israel, U.S. defense officials said, an escalation of the U.S. military effort to deter regional powers from joining the war between Hamas and Israel." - WSJ.

https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/israel-hamas-war-gaza/card/u-s-weighs-deploying-second-aircraft-carrier-group-i4fMGkmj7mGmlQCNqW1W

[Boomer6]

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

The other big question is what about Iran?  Will we turn another blind eye?  Will we be able to restrain Israel?

Do we have a right to restrain Israel? If I’m Israel and an American says that to me I’d highlight the hypocrisy of that based on America’s post 9/11 actions.

Israel currently has more public support than possibly anytime in history. If they, or we, can prove Iran directly caused this attack then I’d love to hear a reason why they don’t have the right, much less the duty to their people to neuter Iran’s ability to harm their country.

[HeloDude]

1 hour ago, Boomer6 said:

Do we have a right to restrain Israel? If I’m Israel and an American says that to me I’d highlight the hypocrisy of that based on America’s post 9/11 actions.

Israel can (and should) do whatever Israel believes they need to do.  Now as to the question of US direct involvement…I think that would be a mistake.  Which is why I think Biden is bluffing as I don’t see him authorizing an attack to support Israel.  So just like Obama’s “red line”…it’s stupid to say this if you’re not going to do anything when it’s crossed.

Side note—where are our resident leftists on this forum?  Aren’t they all about democracies being able to defend themselves when attacked?  Or does this just apply to when Russia is the aggressor?

 

[Biff_T]

17 minutes ago, HeloDude said:

Side note—where are our resident leftists on this forum

Writing some excuses as to why its OK for innocent children to be decapitated and set on fire.  

I am tired of Beta Males and stupid bitches fucking up the world.  Send them to Gaza as peace keepers.  Please go.  Put your money where your mouth is.  Show us how to solve this problem with peace and understanding.   They will applaud you.  You will change the world with your hollow words.   

Remember abortion (killing of some sort of helpless creature inside of a woman)?  War is like abortion for adults.    Here is your time to shine with your Palestinian lovers.

[Clayton Bigsby]

^ okay Macho Man Randy Savage…oooooh yeah ^

[uhhello]

17 minutes ago, Biff_T said:

Writing some excuses as to why its OK for innocent children to be decapitated and set on fire.  

I am tired of Beta Males and stupid bitches fucking up the world.  Send them to Gaza as peace keepers.  Please go.  Put your money where your mouth is.  Show us how to solve this problem with peace and understanding.   They will applaud you.  You will change the world with your hollow words.   

Remember abortion (killing of some sort of helpless creature inside of a woman)?  War is like abortion for adults.    Here is your time to shine with your Palestinian lovers.

You're wearing some form of Punisher paraphernalia as you type that aren't you? 

[Biff_T]

1 hour ago, uhhello said:

You're wearing some form of Punisher paraphernalia as you type that aren't you? 

Always.