Military Move Claims

[Chicken]

We just finished our final PCS and the movers absolutely destroyed our stuff.  Horrendous packing that the QA folks came our and submitted letters of warning to the company.  Incomplete inventory.. Used toilet brushed packed with clothing.  Lost items... absolute clown show.  We issued a claim and in the past have had no issues getting things fixed or replaced.  This time seems different.  They denied a number of items claiming "damage not in transit" when the item was noted as no previous damage and now it's scratched to F.  Other items where a shelf that the driver admitted to completely destroying and testing pics of how bad he F'd it up.  The company denied that as well saying it wasn't on the inventory.  What in the actual F is this clown show?  Did something change in the last 10 years where claims are a nightmare now?  They F'd up our adjustable bed by ripping the cords out and offered $30 for a Chinese knock off that doesn't even work with our bed and they expect me to do the repairs.. 

Is there a better way to navigate this?  Nobody at JPPSO or anywhere else answers their phone.

[Lord Ratner]

39 minutes ago, Chicken said:

We just finished our final PCS and the movers absolutely destroyed our stuff.  Horrendous packing that the QA folks came our and submitted letters of warning to the company.  Incomplete inventory.. Used toilet brushed packed with clothing.  Lost items... absolute clown show.  We issued a claim and in the past have had no issues getting things fixed or replaced.  This time seems different.  They denied a number of items claiming "damage not in transit" when the item was noted as no previous damage and now it's scratched to F.  Other items where a shelf that the driver admitted to completely destroying and testing pics of how bad he F'd it up.  The company denied that as well saying it wasn't on the inventory.  What in the actual F is this clown show?  Did something change in the last 10 years where claims are a nightmare now?  They F'd up our adjustable bed by ripping the cords out and offered $30 for a Chinese knock off that doesn't even work with our bed and they expect me to do the repairs.. 

Is there a better way to navigate this?  Nobody at JPPSO or anywhere else answers their phone.

Just refuse the offer. They'll have an appraiser come out, I've only done it once but the appraiser in some cases just looked at me and asked how much money I wanted for the specific object/fix. When they do an assessment of what a repair costs, they do it on the assumption that you are using similar materials and a professional to do the repair. Anybody who's been conscious for the last 4 years knows that labor is extremely expensive these days, so if you get a couple example quotes you'll have the appraiser in your pocket. Almost every single thing was deemed more expensive to repair than to replace.

[HossHarris]

When all else fails, go talk to tmo and file a claim with base legal office. 

[Smokin]

Totally agree that you need to tell them to take their offer and shove it.  They will almost always throw out a low ball offer and tell you it's the final offer and take it or leave it.  It's just their way of buying you off for pennies on the dollar.  Legal will get you way more and there's a chance the dirtbag company gets banned, especially if you have some pictures and can prove they lied.

Obviously a bit late for you now, but some advice for others:  Take pictures and/or videos of everything even remotely valuable in the couple days before the movers show up.  Also, go through their pick-up inventory with a fine tooth comb before you sign.  They're going to try to rush you as they want to leave and you're going to be ready for them to leave as well, but it's your stuff that they probably are going to break.

Before a move overseas, we bought some new furniture a week before the move.  The movers marked up the brand new furniture on the inventory to make it look like we had picked it up off the curb.  I told the movers they could open up the crate, unload it, and show me the damage (it was one of the first things they loaded) or I wouldn't sign it.  Obviously they refused to do that, so I crossed out almost all of their condition annotations and wrote "brand new".  We got everything we claimed on that move.

Finally, I know not everyone is inclined to do a DITY, but I had such bad experiences on my last two TMO moves that I didn't even consider using them again.  In 5 full DITYs, I've broken less things total than TMO movers broke in a single move.  The rules also recently changed so you get more money.  I made over two months pay on my final DITY.  It was some serious work and some stress, but everything that I care about arrived in the same condition as we left.

[Herkdrvr]

Several have already given you solid advice. 

Another path is to go to your IG office & submit a complaint. Tell the IG TMO/JPPSO is not responsive despite having known about this mover's lousy performance at the outset of your move. As far as a resolution, tell the IG you want a face-to-face with a knowledgeable QA representative & weekly updates on their subsequent interactions with the contractor. The IG should help get the appropriate people in touch with you.  

[jice]

Similar experience recently. Recommended steps after that experience:

1) Submit claim with the TSP. They are required to pay full replacement value for a “like item.” Their definition of “like item” will be ridiculous most of the time (Nice mitre saw is “like” Fisher Price’s baby’s first mitre saw). 
2) Refuse initial low-ball offer, attempt to demonstrate the difference in like items and remind them of FRV obligation. Submit counter-offer.
2b) If you’ve got a lawyer friend willing to write a letter explaining the above, that might help them understand.

3) They’ll likely double down on stupidity. Submit claim through base legal. You’ll immediately be paid a depreciated value of the item. Then! The government will attempt to recoup the DV AND the difference in DV vs  FRV. If they do, you’ll get a check for the difference.

4) Once the TSP gets a letter from a lawyer from the federal government telling them they’re about to be sued, they’ll likely cough up the FRV.  “Go away” money is way less expensive than defending a stupid position.

 

[brabus]

For anyone out there - Last mil move was a DITY, and the last big move after that was a full civ move (a DITY without the reimbursement). Two smoothest, least stressful moves of our lives. Always do DITY to minimize, or totally avoid, bullshit like this. Its not hard, just takes some time, but a lot less time than you’ll spend dealing with the shit Chicken is going through. 

[Chicken]

Appreciate the advice.. we've only had to claim a few things in the past and it was either fixed of replaced.  Super easy.. I imagine this time is different because we are claiming 32 items so far.  The origin services were absolute garbage and obviously had no idea how to pack a normal move let alone military.  $hit like telling me that they only wrap pictures and TVs in brown paper because "they don't make mirror cartons that large" or asking me for a marker 6 hours into the pack because they forgot one and now we're going to play the guessing game of what is in what box and where it came from so we can properly label it.  My personal favorite was the white pillows on the couch (that they completely destroyed) they told me they wouldn't pack those because "the driver will use those to cushion the load in the truck".  I $hit you not I wish I was kidding.

[Boomer6]

We need a Bird Book for crap like this. Bout to move, go to the base ops MIL move page and see a list of dog shit moving contractors at each base and the issues ppl had etc.