Changing/Switching airframes

[Hacker]

6 hours ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Done several IEP rides. 

 

Based on what you're saying in this thread, it sounds like you haven't learned any of the lessons that are intended to be conveyed during IEP.

[Hacker]

Amidst all the bleeding pussies, slighted egoes, and hurt feelings around this topic, don't forget that these are decisions based on qualifications that would likely translate to success in the IFF, FTU, and MQT training pipelines.  It has nothing to do with ego.  It is "gatekeeping", yes, because the AF doesn't have unlimited money to throw at people to see if they will make it -- they have to make educated and calculated decisions.

Again, the Colonels and Generals who are kicking this stuff around saw the last iteration of the puppet show and how that turned out -- hell, some of them may have even been participants in it themselves.

Since the results previously were marginal/acceptable at best with T-38 trained pilots, what is the logic some of you have behind thinking that opening it up to pilots with no fast jet single-pilot decisionmaking experience would deliver a better result?  With a T-38 trained pilot, there is at least some sort of measured, documented performance that shows adaptability to that flying environment and theoretically the potential to succeed.  With a T-1 trained pilot, there is no measured documented performance of those tasks...so which is the riskier bet?  Again, it isn't about talent, it is about experience.

As said, everyone realizes there are probably a number of T-1 trained MAF dudes who would excel when retrained as a pointy-noser using the existent T-38 requal/IFF/FTU/MQT syllabi, but the AF can't build policy based on what are likely statistical outliers.

Edited April 17, 2017 by Hacker

[herkbum]

Maybe they were T-44 trained...

Or C-12 trained


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[Duck]

What a complete 180 from the "whats wrong with the air force" thread. Over there people are saying they are getting out because big Air Force and leadership treated them like shit while they were serving their ADSC. Now you are consciously making the decision to do the same with those under you? No wonder your community is begging for more pilots. 

I would have hoped you would have seen the dripping satire and you realized this was from an Air Force Leadership Logic perspective and in no way was I suggesting this was a "good idea"...

 

 

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[Best-22]

1 minute ago, Duck said:

I would have hoped you would have seen the dripping satire and you realized this was from an Air Force Leadership Logic perspective and in no way was I suggesting this was a "good idea"...

 

 

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Noted. My mistake.

[Duck]

It's all good. The toxicity is everywhere so I shouldn't take anything for granted. Someone, somewhere is thinking how to best screw people over "for the needs of the Air Force".


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[LookieRookie]

Crossflow talk aside, I think it's weird a FAIP decided to make an account pretending to be the mouthpiece for every FAIP in the AF, past and present.

[Duck]

Crossflow talk aside, I think it's weird a FAIP decided to make an account pretending to be the mouthpiece for every FAIP in the AF, past and present.

Not really. Pretty much every FAIP ever... zing!


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[matmacwc]

9 hours ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Absolutely. There should be two separate types of ratings and two different pair of wings given honestly.

Maybe I wasn't clear, my thoughts on FAIPS:

And for you former FAIPS, don't get offended, you aren't there anymore.

Edited April 17, 2017 by matmacwc

[pawnman]

3 hours ago, jazzdude said:

I think the goal is to grab heavy guys, that, after 1 fighter ops tour and "experienced", will be sent to fill an 11F staff billet. Less about flying a fighter, more about the AF saying "I need a body from a particular year group to fill an 11F staff billet in 4ish years, and I don't have enough 11Fs in those year groups to fill the staffs and operational requirements so I'll make some new ones via cross flow."

If that wasn't the case, I can't see a reason for cross flow. Just increase production at the UPT/FTU level to get bodies in cockpits, and you'll have them in the community much longer. A cross flow steals a FTU seat with lower payback, so there needs to be a strong reason for cross flowing them over.

Hell, why bother?  11B/12Bs have been filling 11F billets for years.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, HU&W said:

I just want to know if the dudes that dropped the MOAB from the MC-130 were T-1 or T-38 grads.

Was it a hand flown drop and did the pilot flying get his own ATIS?

 

 

[HU&W]

23 minutes ago, 1111 said:

Was it a hand flown drop and did the pilot flying get his own ATIS?

ATIS?  Where they're going, they don't need ATIS.  #AFSOC

[Hermey]

 I've seen many classes in my career where only the top 38 guy was truly happy on assignment night and all others felt they failed as they just missed the mark. This program may allow a second chance to those that had bad luck and timing on assignment night (and I'm talking more about the 09-12 classes than the more recent Oprah "fighters for everyone" classes).

This crossflow program is very limited (4 slots) and they will only pull from very high performing officers in and out of the jet in the MAF. Specifically, it looks like they are targeting some of the year groups that had low numbers go to fighters. I agree with others on here that this is likely to increase the 11F numbers for staff or other unwanted bills later.

For the guys that missed their first chance but still hold on to that dream of flying a fighter I say go for it. Even if it's just one Ops tour followed by a staff or whatever other long term plans they have in mind for these dudes. I'm glad some guys might get to cross over to fly their dream plane, and also glad it won't be faipmafiaoffical.

[pawnman]

2 minutes ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Lol you showed me

You'll do great in a fighter squadron.

[pilotguy]

13 minutes ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Finished #1 in T-6s by a mile and turned down a 38 for literally this very reason. I'll be aight

I will say this is way more common than you think.  I've seen classes where the first 38 goes to the #4 active duty kid. Getting a 38 out of pilot training does not mean you were top of your T-6 class.

 So ya I think this must be the basis of his "must have flown a 38 to cross flow is bullshit" argument.  

[YoungnDumb]

16 minutes ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Finished #1 in T-6s by a mile and turned down a 38 for literally this very reason. I'll be aight

Good for you, now STFU.

[pawnman]

42 minutes ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Finished #1 in T-6s by a mile and turned down a 38 for literally this very reason. I'll be aight

You turned down T-38s to argue with people on the internet?

[Kenny Powers]

I will say this is way more common than you think.  I've seen classes where the first 38 goes to the #4 active duty kid. Getting a 38 out of pilot training does not mean you were top of your T-6 class.
 So ya I think this must be the basis of his "must have flown a 38 to cross flow is bullshit" argument.  

Nobody gives a shit about T-6's except in the UPT world. In fact, nobody gives a shit how you performed in T-38's after assignment night. Most guys get better with time, so if you make it through, continue to work your ass off and you'll have a blast flying fighters.

I can say, with absolute certainty, that how you perform in T-6s has absolutely nothing to do with how you'll perform in a fighter squadron. As Hacker said, at least if a guy flew 38s and graduated, you know he has the potential. If a guy never flew 38s, it's unknown, regardless of if he "finished T6s #1 by a mile."

FAIPmafia turned down 38s. Great. Thanks for doing us fighter guys a solid. But now he's bitching about flying 38s being a requirement, and is pretty sure he's going to be "aight"? YGBSM.



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[pilotguy]

14 minutes ago, Kenny Powers said:

 

Nobody gives a shit about T-6's except in the UPT world. In fact, nobody gives a shit how you performed in T-38's after assignment night. Most guys get better with time, so if you make it through, continue to work your ass off and you'll have a blast flying fighters.

I can say, with absolute certainty, that how you perform in T-6s has absolutely nothing to do with how you'll perform in a fighter squadron. As Hacker said, at least if a guy flew 38s and graduated, you know he has the potential. If a guy never flew 38s, it's unknown, regardless of if he "finished T6s #1 by a mile."

FAIPmafia turned down 38s. Great. Thanks for doing us fighter guys a solid. But now he's bitching about flying 38s being a requirement, and is pretty sure he's going to be "aight"? YGBSM.



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The Air Force cares about how you did in T-6s because they won't let you cross flow right now unless you flew a 38 in UPT.  They are disqualifying like 75% the pilot force by that one stipulation alone. He's just saying that lots of guys have the capacity to learn that aren't eligible because of that one rule. 

I get what he's saying but he's still a raging douche about it. 

But it's for what, 8 guys total, right now? So ya requiring that right now isn't bullshit at all that's just stupid

Edited April 17, 2017 by pilotguy

[Duck]

Finished Middle Third of T-6s. Finished #1 in T-38s. Had I not been at ENJJPT I would not have even gotten a T-38.

Our #1 T-6 guy finished bottom third of T-38s and almost got a UAV.


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[pilotguy]

14 minutes ago, Duck said:

Finished Middle Third of T-6s. Finished #1 in T-38s. Had I not been at ENJJPT I would not have even gotten a T-38.

Our #1 T-6 guy finished bottom third of T-38s and almost got a UAV.


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Had you not been at ENJJPT you would've not been eligible to cross flow right now then. Crazy

 

A selection process (enjjpt) that happens in college before you lay a finger on a control of an airplane opens doors to people that are closed off to like 75% or whatever of pilots in the Air Force. That's interesting to think about too

Edited April 17, 2017 by pilotguy

[Sprkt69]

2 hours ago, pilotguy said:

The Air Force cares about how you did in T-6s because they won't let you cross flow right now unless you flew a 38 in UPT.  They are disqualifying like 75% the pilot force by that one stipulation alone. He's just saying that lots of guys have the capacity to learn that aren't eligible because of that one rule. 

I get what he's saying but he's still a raging douche about it. 

But it's for what, 8 guys total, right now? So ya requiring that right now isn't bullshit at all that's just stupid

Life is a series of choices, timing and luck. So why are you upset that a choice someone makes closes a door for opportunity?

[Sprkt69]

3 hours ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Finished #1 in T-6s by a mile and turned down a 38 for literally this very reason. I'll be aight

So let me get this straight, you finished #1 in Phase 2 "by a mile" and did so well in Phase 3 you got FAIP'd? Sounds like you nailed it

[pilotguy]

Just now, Sprkt69 said:

Life is a series of choices, timing and luck. So why are you upset that a choice someone makes closes a door for opportunity?

I'm not upset haha I'm just now realizing that I should've applied to enjjpt and shoulda tried to fly the 38 even though I don't necessarily want to fly fighters just to keep all options open down the road. 

[pilotguy]

6 minutes ago, faipmafiaofficial said:

Alright after re-reading I've concluded that I'm wrong in basically every part of this. Sounded like a tool as well. My b.  I'll go back to flying my heavies and leave it to the people who know what they are talking about. I don't want people thinking negatively about faips because of me. Carry on

Lol an apology on a message board...that's rare