Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[TnkrToad]

Perhaps coincidental, but worth noting: AFPC hasn't posted any updates to ACP take rates for a month now. Explanations would seem to be:

- The ACP folks at AFPC are lazy or simply forgot--plausible

- The number of ACP takers hasn't changed substantially in a month, so posting new numbers is pointless--seems most likely explanation. Of course, this would be cause for concern; the 20 yr option encourages folks to take the bonus earlier, not later

- The number of ACP takers this year is exceeding all expectations, so the folks in AFPC are overwhelmed processing ACP applications and/or the numbers are changing so rapidly that they don't have time to post an update--I suspect this is not the root problem

TT

 

[Fuzz]

1 hour ago, TnkrToad said:

Perhaps coincidental, but worth noting: AFPC hasn't posted any updates to ACP take rates for a month now. Explanations would seem to be:

- The ACP folks at AFPC are lazy or simply forgot--plausible

- The number of ACP takers hasn't changed substantially in a month, so posting new numbers is pointless--seems most likely explanation. Of course, this would be cause for concern; the 20 yr option encourages folks to take the bonus earlier, not later

- The number of ACP takers this year is exceeding all expectations, so the folks in AFPC are overwhelmed processing ACP applications and/or the numbers are changing so rapidly that they don't have time to post an update--I suspect this is not the root problem

TT

 

I wouldn't put it all on red, but I'd highly consider it.

[ThreeHoler]

My bet is the one dude that processes the applications is on leave.

[BFM this]

My bet is the one dude that processes the applications is on leave.

365

[ThreeHoler]

Nah, he's a GS.

[Ram]

I remember when they furloughed him during the sequester, delaying the ACP applications.

Something about different pots of money...

[TnkrToad]

I wonder if the ACP guy reads this forum...updated stats are posted. BLUF, it appears the ACP guy hadn't posted anything new, since there was little change to report. I think the lack of change is worth reporting, however. FY16 stats below:

- Bombers: No more takers; still 25%

- C2ISR: 1 more taker--now 43.9%

- Fighters: 5 more takers--now 27.2%

- Mobility: 7 more takers--now 35.1%

- Rescue: 1 more taker--now 69% 

- SOF: 1 more taker--now 35.9%

- Unmanned: No more takers--still 51.7%

-- Overall FY16 pilot take rate--increased a whopping 2% in a month--now 35.5% overall

I won't bother with the FY17 early taker breakdown, but the number of FY17 early takers increased by 33--Overall FY17 early take rate is now 13.9%

Armchair analysis: 

The above stats don't bode well for the Air Force, but a few things are worth noting: 

- Fighter and Bomber bubbas seem especially unmotivated right now. Their communities' take rates are the lowest for both FY16 and FY17 eligibles

- Rescue, C2ISR and--surprisingly--Unmanned seem content. They're signing up at comparatively high rates  

- Based on sheer mass, though, it seems Mobility pilots will end up running the Air Force. There are as many FY16 takers so far in the Mobility community as there are in the Fighter, Rescue and SOF communities combined

TT

[guineapigfury]

The 11U numbers are misleading if you're considering overall RPA pilot retention.  The majority of 11X pilots in the RPA communities are still 11M/B/F.  Only those who recatted to 11U are going to show up in the RPA take-rate.

Edited February 11, 2016 by guineapigfury

[TnkrToad]

33 minutes ago, guineapigfury said:

The 11U numbers are misleading if you're considering overall RPA pilot retention.  The majority of 11X pilots in the RPA communities are still 11M/B/F.  Only those who recatted to 11U are going to show up in the RPA take-rate.

Point well taken. That does put a different spin on things:

- Barely over half of those pilots in the year's group of eligibles who loved RPAs enough to willingly recat to 11U have signed up for the bonus . . . and based on zero new takers in the last month, it is unlikely substantially more will. Not good news for a community the Air Force is growing

- The three manned pilot communities primarily responsible for filling RPA billets (11B, 11F, & 11M) have the lowest take rates thus far

Too bad AFPC doesn't break down take 11x take rates between those filling RPA billets and those filling the standard flying/staff billets for their respective communities. 

Sure glad the Air Force is expanding its RPA operation. While necessary, it's coming at a huge cost. Like I've hinted at in a different thread, ground commanders are more than happy to keep screaming for ever-more air (especially RPA) support, because it doesn't cost them anything. When air leaders provide support, they get little credit--it's our job. When they say no, we're outta Schlitz, the ground guys get to complain about Air Force nonsupport. 

TT

[17D_guy]

I enjoy this topic very much.  Thanks for keeping it updated.  I wonder if AFPC will provide the same information for the recently updated SRB for the enlisted in the distressed careerfields.  Would be interesting to compare the take rates between the two separate, but different, programs.

[osulax05]

I originally posted this in the military cuts thread, but the tanker clown music overshadowed it.

Anybody have insight into this verbiage from the NDAA?

 

Posted Sunday at 8:28 AM

On November 26, 2015 at 10:30 PM, deaddebate said:

It's signed and done.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2015/11/25/statement-president

From the text:

REPORT.—Not later than February 1, 2016, the Secretary of Defense shall submit to the congressional defense committees a report setting forth the empirical case for an increase in special and incentive pay for aviation officers in order to address a specific, statistically-based retention problem with respect to such officers. The report shall include the results of a study, conducted by the Secretary in connection with the case, on a market-based compensa-tion approach to the retention of such officers that considers the pay and allowances offered by commercial airlines to pilots and the propensity of pilots to leave the Air Force to become commercial airline pilots. 

 

 

 1

[Azimuth]

On February 1, 2016 at 2:42 PM, brabus said:

One thing I and a few other bros have noticed (we're not the first, I'm sure) is when given an opportunity to talk relatively frankly with a GO about the AF/why dudes hate it and want to get out, they flat out refuse to believe the AF is different than when they were CGOs/FGOs.  Even when presented with facts and emotionless arguments, they clearly maintain the memory of what it was like for them as a Lt/Capt/Maj and how it has to be the same now; everyone younger than them are just a bunch of pussies, don't have "the big picture," etc.  I'm all for a backhand of reality to whiners, but you can't ride the "you're being a pussy" train because you're presented with facts that don't support your side of the story.  This whole issue might see better traction if senior leadership started believing it's CGOs/FGOs on the state of the AF instead of being the incredibly out of touch old guy who refused to open his eyes after 1995.

Didn't know you had the "opportunity" to talk to McDew...

Edited February 20, 2016 by Azimuth

[Gazmo]

I originally posted this in the military cuts thread, but the tanker clown music overshadowed it.

Anybody have insight into this verbiage from the NDAA?

  Posted Sunday at 8:28 AM

It's signed and done.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2015/11/25/statement-president

From the text:

REPORT.—Not later than February 1, 2016, the Secretary of Defense shall submit to the congressional defense committees a report setting forth the empirical case for an increase in special and incentive pay for aviation officers in order to address a specific, statistically-based retention problem with respect to such officers. The report shall include the results of a study, conducted by the Secretary in connection with the case, on a market-based compensa-tion approach to the retention of such officers that considers the pay and allowances offered by commercial airlines to pilots and the propensity of pilots to leave the Air Force to become commercial airline pilots. 

 

 

 1

Great. About 5 yrs too late...

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Herkasaurus]

Wg/CC at my base is meeting with bonus eligibles, initials, earlys, and 2yr earlys to discuss the ARP. Maybe Wg/CC's per that verbiage above have to help write said report. I've never heard of an O-6 sitting down with aircrew to ask these questions. Much less the damn wing CC.

Any other Wg/CC's out there having a sit down to find out why no one wants to sink with the ship?

[Champ Kind]

Wg/CC at my base is meeting with bonus eligibles, initials, earlys, and 2yr earlys to discuss the ARP. Maybe Wg/CC's per that verbiage above have to help write said report. I've never heard of an O-6 sitting down with aircrew to ask these questions. Much less the damn wing CC.

Any other Wg/CC's out there having a sit down to find out why no one wants to sink with the ship?

Curious if he's meeting with takers and non-takers in the eligible pool.

[Right Seat Driver]

1 hour ago, Herkasaurus said:

Wg/CC at my base is meeting with bonus eligibles, initials, earlys, and 2yr earlys to discuss the ARP. Maybe Wg/CC's per that verbiage above have to help write said report. I've never heard of an O-6 sitting down with aircrew to ask these questions. Much less the damn wing CC.

Any other Wg/CC's out there having a sit down to find out why no one wants to sink with the ship?

Isn't there a reason why the senior rater is not supposed to know who are the takers and the non-takers?  This statement brings me back to the old-heads who talked about being kicked to the side for not taking the bonus in the 90s because they "showed their cards."

[Herk Driver]

Wg/CC at my base is meeting with bonus eligibles, initials, earlys, and 2yr earlys to discuss the ARP. Maybe Wg/CC's per that verbiage above have to help write said report. I've never heard of an O-6 sitting down with aircrew to ask these questions. Much less the damn wing CC.

Any other Wg/CC's out there having a sit down to find out why no one wants to sink with the ship?

Isn't there a reason why the senior rater is not supposed to know who are the takers and the non-takers?  This statement brings me back to the old-heads who talked about being kicked to the side for not taking the bonus in the 90s because they "showed their cards."

Where did you hear that? The takers and non takers are identified within AMS. The feet on the ramp policy was an AF policy...not individual senior raters taking any action.

[sqwatch]

Where has butters been?

[Herkasaurus]

7 hours ago, Champ Kind said:

Curious if he's meeting with takers and non-takers in the eligible pool.

One of the emails that was resent  had a dude's name taken off of it since he already took the bonus. It was weird cause the list has a few prior E's on there who I thought weren't bonus eligible. I assume it's an AMS pull of everyone who hasn't taken the bonus. But I don't have a damn clue, I just see the email traffic and wonder while I wait for my parole. 

[Jaded]

I assume the meeting is so he can tell everyone about the quality of life changes that the Air Force is about to make to improve pilot retention.

[xaarman]

Everything bad is temporary.

You can only change things if you want to stay in.

Don't be greedy or selfish. Haven't you heard of our second core value, Service Before Self? Nobody joined the military to get rich. I can't be the only one who joined for the honor and privilege of serving my country.

You all took an oath.

Am I missing any?

 

 

Edited February 21, 2016 by xaarman

[Jaded]

You forgot, "We don't really understand why people are leaving. Can you give us feedback (yet again) so we may make real, lasting change at the Air Force level?"

[Champ Kind]

Curious if he's meeting with takers and non-takers in the eligible pool.

One of the emails that was resent  had a dude's name taken off of it since he already took the bonus. It was weird cause the list has a few prior E's on there who I thought weren't bonus eligible. I assume it's an AMS pull of everyone who hasn't taken the bonus. But I don't have a damn clue, I just see the email traffic and wonder while I wait for my parole. 

The provision in the bonus contract that previously limited prior-Es due to total time in service at end of their UPT commitment was changed with this year's program.

[Right Seat Driver]

13 hours ago, Herk Driver said:

Where did you hear that? The takers and non takers are identified within AMS. The feet on the ramp policy was an AF policy...not individual senior raters taking any action.

Copy, thanks for the clarification.

[Fuzz]

10 hours ago, xaarman said:

Everything bad is temporary.

You can only change things if you want to stay in.

Don't be greedy or selfish. Haven't you heard of our second core value, Service Before Self? Nobody joined the military to get rich. I can't be the only one who joined for the honor and privilege of serving my country.

You all took an oath.

Am I missing any?

 

 

I joined to serve my country not get rich, however I also joined an organization that touts integrity first but has a horrendous toxic leadership problem. Everything bad is only temporary if those in the leadership positions with the power to change it actually care, so far senior leadership seems content to keep their head buried in the sand as people run for the exits. People are bailing this ship left and right and nobody is asking why because they hold to the idiotic mentalities of "if you don't like it get out" or "there's always someone to take your place". Most people are tired of being deployed to fight a war with no long term strategy or staring down the barrel of a 365 after years gone already because nobody will throw the bullshit flag on useless or obsolete deployed billets. I'm tired of hearing my career field is overmanned and watch AFPC make forces cuts like a bull in a china shop, while I'm left trying to fill lines with no bodies available or quick turn the crew to their 2nd or 3rd trip in a row because there's literally nobody else. I watch my tanker bros come home from a 60 day deployment to turn right back out to another 60 day deployment a month later. I'm tired of leaders who refuse to step up and tell Congress we don't have the people and funding to perform the missions they task us with, while watching those same people bend over backwards day in and day out to ensure the mission doesn't fail while hoping that help is just around the corner.

I'm proud to wear my uniform on a daily basis but that doesn't mean there isn't a problem with our organization and it is most certainly not above scrutiny.

Edited February 21, 2016 by Fuzz