Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[pawnman]

On 12/19/2016 at 9:51 AM, General Chang said:

We have a plan to backfill the bomber community with additional UPT grads to make up for any shortfall you may see over the next few years due to staff demands.  It will be better for your communities as well, since new pilots have more longevity.  All-around win-win.  

 

Hopefully the fighter and RPA guys get excited about the first bonus raise in a generation.  Definitely a sweet pot of money on that rainbow: $35K/yr for 9 years!  I am pleased that the issue of "raising the bonus" finally worked out.  We had a lot of personnelists spend many hours to make sure our pilots are paid the correct amount via the bonus.  Very exciting that it finally happened.  Pilots, wherever you are at, please thank a personnelist.  That small gesture will make a world of difference.

 

Merry Christmas, all.

UPT grads won't solve my WSO problem.  It also doesn't solve my FTU manning problem.

[ViperMan]

11 hours ago, pawnman said:

UPT grads won't solve my WSO problem.

Nothing can solve that!

[BADFNZ]

4 hours ago, ViperMan said:

Nothing can solve that!

I wouldn't say nothing.

[Learjetter]

Nothing can solve that!

I wouldn't say nothing.

That's funny right there...I don't care who you are.

[pawnman]

On 12/21/2016 at 5:44 PM, ViperMan said:

Nothing can solve that!

Har har, but the reality is I have a tougher time scheduling instructor WSOs than I do scheduling instructor pilots.  Probably because of the shorter ADSCs, but also because there's only one place that makes new WSOs (Pensacola) vs the half-dozen bases that make new pilots.

[08Dawg]

The 11B exodus to fill white jet cockpits has already begun with no sign that it's getting better. Our line squadrons and FTU are already feeling the resultant pinch. All those guys were ACs six months to a year from IP upgrade, and now they're gone.  The Buff FTU is getting a T-1 FAIP and a new UPT T-1 grad in our next class, so it seems Chang's nefarious plan is already in motion. 

[pawnman]

11 hours ago, 08Dawg said:

The 11B exodus to fill white jet cockpits has already begun with no sign that it's getting better. Our line squadrons and FTU are already feeling the resultant pinch. All those guys were ACs six months to a year from IP upgrade, and now they're gone.  The Buff FTU is getting a T-1 FAIP and a new UPT T-1 grad in our next class, so it seems Chang's nefarious plan is already in motion. 

I just keep reminding myself that our functional at AFPC, in the webinar he hosted a few months ago, told us squadron manning was "AFPC's #1 priority", and of those squadrons, "FTUs are #1a, ahead of ops units".  I'm still waiting to see that prioritization have any effect on the manning.

[pawnman]

11 hours ago, Kiloalpha said:

To make matters even worse, there's only two Reserve Component units that those 11B's can apply their talents to if they felt so inclined. It's a direct loss of talent.

Especially since they located the B-1 Reserve at Dyess.  I know dozens of people who don't want to live in Abilene for the rest of their lives, but would have jumped at the chance to live in Rapid City permanently.

[08Dawg]

14 hours ago, Kiloalpha said:

To make matters even worse, there's only two Reserve Component units that those 11B's can apply their talents to if they felt so inclined. It's a direct loss of talent.

Even further complicating the issue is that most of the 11Bs who do go reserves are min-participating TRs and fly their 737 or A320 more than a Buff or Bone.  Good on them, but bad on us for not doing what's necessary to make it worth their while to stick around on a more full-time basis. 

I know the AFPC functional, and I trust his intentions are good.  The intent isn't being met at the OG level.  We had two inbound instructors picked off for other on-base assignments just recently.  FTU Priority 1, right?  Not so much, it seems...

[Learjetter]

16 hours ago, Kiloalpha said:

To make matters even worse, there's only two Reserve Component units that those 11B's can apply their talents to if they felt so inclined. It's a direct loss of talent.

That's not entirely true...every one of the AOCs has an ARC component...no better TET / MAAP / COD folks exist than 11Bs...unless its 12Bs.  Written tongue-in-cheek, but I know several who left AD for the airlines and the ARC and went to such a unit.

 

[TnkrToad]

On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2016 at 5:16 AM, pawnman said:

UPT grads won't solve my WSO problem.  It also doesn't solve my FTU manning problem.

...But, you see, the problem is that GC & his cronies are trying to solve their WSO/CSO/Nav problems with UPT grads (at least indirectly), but they refuse to acknowledge that they are doing so.

There were about 5,000 Navs (by this I mean Navs/CSOs/WSOs--whatever you wanna call them) in the AF in 2005. Now, we've got about 3,500. The OSS/staff/command/CAOC/deployed to Buttkrakistan to backfill Army guys/etc. workload didn't decrease by 30% over the last decade, so guess what? Pilot types have had to backfill billets that Navs might otherwise have filled. Ergo, we are trying to use UPT grads to solve the WSO problem . . . an expensive proposition that ticks people off and makes them all the more susceptible to the siren song of life outside of Big Blue.

Tying this back to the ACP discussion, I find it odd that there's so much handwringing over an 11F shortage, when the pilot shortages are across all MDSs. Sticking to what I know/my parochial interests, the Nav community that's taken the biggest hit over the past decade is the 12Ms. Not surprising--with the advent GPS/better avionics, one doesn't need 'em. Problem is that 11Ms are filling billets that 12Ms would normally have filled, at the same time the civilian sector is drawing 11Ms away from active duty at substantial rates, while at the same time MAF folks are backfilling CAF & SOF billets . . . yet global airlift & tanker requirements ain't really subsided. 

The resulting experience loss across the board is substantial. In 2005, there were 3,500 Command Pilots in the AF. Today there are 2,100. In '05, there were 1,900 Master Navs; today, there are 600. That sure looks like a helluva brain drain--notably in the mobility community--and given the current civilian hiring picture, I don't see our ability to retain experienced aviators getting any better.

While I fully understand that certain pilot communities are hurting worse than others, I can't escape the conclusion targeted bonuses for select pilot communities in FY17 ACP would be a galactically bad idea.  

Rant off.

TT

[daynightindicator]

Running with this discussion, what do you think about the overall shrinking of the CAF pilot/WSO force (fewer manned a/c in the future) wrt future staff bullets and strategy/force development? Will RPA pilots be able to lead development of future airpower strategies despite lack of "air sense" in the traditional regard?

No offense to anyone with this, just wondering since, despite the fact we all hate staff, there is a reason we send dudes to those billets. And for an 11F staff billet, I think there's a degradation in output when you put a non 11F in that position.


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[LookieRookie]

On 12/23/2016 at 11:24 AM, 08Dawg said:

Even further complicating the issue is that most of the 11Bs who do go reserves are min-participating TRs and fly their 737 or A320 more than a Buff or Bone.  Good on them, but bad on us for not doing what's necessary to make it worth their while to stick around on a more full-time basis. 

 

Good luck getting AFRC to give more money.  ART jobs just aren't desirable like they used to be, even with superior qual/recruitment/retention bonuses. Everyone wants MPA while their apps are in at the majors .

[ThreeHoler]

In 2005, there were 3,500 Command Pilots in the AF. Today there are 2,100.

There are also a lot of MAF O-5 Sq/CC types who are very challenged to get the toilet bowl because they spent so much time on staff / at school they never got the hours or the gate months to earn their final set of wings.

[TnkrToad]

5 hours ago, ThreeHoler said:

There are also a lot of MAF O-5 Sq/CC types who are very challenged to get the toilet bowl because they spent so much time on staff / at school they never got the hours or the gate months to earn their final set of wings.

 

Considering all one needs is 15 years and 3k hours (or failing that, 144 gate months), that's ridiculous. On the tanker side, there were guys coming out of their first assignments at Grand Forks the 2005-ish timeframe with well over 2,000 hours already.  Folks in the MAF community who can't build 3k hrs are a mystery to me; must've been folks who spent a lot of time at Mildenhall/somewhere like that which didn't fly much--in spite of a war going on. Even then, 12 yrs' worth of gate months ain't that hard to come by, even with school and a staff assignment. 

TT

[Karl Hungus]

8 hours ago, ThreeHoler said:

There are also a lot of MAF O-5 Sq/CC types who are MAF O-5 Sq/CC types because all of their more talented peers fled for greener pastures.

 

Fixed that for you.  

[osulax05]

Any insight on if monthly flight pay (ACIP) is going to go up? I saw that the services CAN pay up to $1000 per month now. 

Edited December 29, 2016 by osulax05

[Chida]

It would be a DOD policy since flight pay is the same for all services. I don't see the services lobbying DOD to increase it because nowadays they would view it as giving something for nothing. USAF, for example, will always want an ADSC in exchange for more money.


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[ThreeHoler]

It would be a DOD policy since flight pay is the same for all services. I don't see the services lobbying DOD to increase it because nowadays they would view it as giving something for nothing. USAF, for example, will always want an ADSC in exchange for more money.


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AF/A3 seemed pretty on fire about more money solves the problems...

[osulax05]

DFAS posted the 2017 paychart. No increase to ACIP. 

[pawnman]

2 hours ago, osulax05 said:

DFAS posted the 2017 paychart. No increase to ACIP. 

Merry Christmas, boys!

[F16Deuce]

2 hours ago, osulax05 said:

DFAS posted the 2017 paychart. No increase to ACIP. 

This is my surprised face.

[Vprdrvr69]

20 hours ago, osulax05 said:

DFAS posted the 2017 paychart. No increase to ACIP. 

I'm shocked. Guess GC and his cronies have it all figured out. I can't thank dipshits like him enough. As a 2nd year UAL guy now, I pick up a 3% pay raise in Jan, which on average months, nets me 150% what I made as a AD Major. In Feb I get a nice 4.4% raise again (thanks DAL bubbas). Then, in mid-Feb I'll receive a profit sharing check that exceeds GC's entire monthly pay, whatever his rank actually is. Shortly thereafter I hit year 3 and pick up another 23% pay hike. 

On top of it all, I average over half of the month off and currently live three miles from Lake Tahoe. My family finally has a home and is happy. Even my fu(&;ng dog is a happy camper. Life isn't perfect but it's pretty damn good and exponentially better than it ever could've been on AD. I do USAFR shit on the side because I want to and don't let it detract from my life. It doesn't pay and also doesn't interfere while still letting me do something worthwhile. There is no comparison between where I was and where I am.

I didn't post to brag. I posted to help those facing such a grand decision and turning point in their lives. Take the leap. Life is good. If you don't, mama blue will be there to coddle you and GC will be there to continue ass probing you with big black veiny!

[HossHarris]

You can always come back .... probably

[Gazmo]

Good luck getting AFRC to give more money.  ART jobs just aren't desirable like they used to be, even with superior qual/recruitment/retention bonuses. Everyone wants MPA while their apps are in at the majors .

The ARC is going through their own problems. I Palace Chased to the ANG over a decade ago and open ART/AGR positions at the time were non-existant. My unit had at least a dozen bums brown-nosing as much as they could to prove their worth so the unit would even think about hiring them into the next opening. More than half of our full-time positions were filled by Lt Col's (furloughed airline pilots) who got hired into lots of vacancies (from the 99-01 airline hiring boom) after 9/11.

Today, it's full-timer mass exodus all over again. We can't fill full-time jobs with anyone other than 2Lt's fresh out of UPT. It's great for them. A GS-13 job as an Lt is not so shabby cash for someone with very little responsibility. We can't even fill AGR jobs. Noone wants to be stuck in a long tour in the event a legacy calls them.

We've got part-timers who are taking non-flying jobs (both inside and outside the unit) to finish out their last few years to get to 20 for a Guard retirement. We've got others who are pushing the button right at 20 when in years past, they'd go to 28 as a Lt Col. You have to understand that a 15+ year FO at UPS who makes near $20k a month loses a lot of money to drop a trip to come do duty at the unit or even more to do a 30 day rotation in CENTCOM.

AGR's get the same pilot bonus Active Duty gets and they are just now giving incentive bonuses to ART's, but at the end of the day, very few besides the ones who don't have enough flight time to get to major airline, are interested.

The ART program is antiquated and not on par with the pay/benefits of a commercial airline job. There are specific job series groups who get special payscales and better retirement benefits (ATC and LEO), but for some reason they chose to keep the pilot series the same as every other GS (aside from a flat 30% locality across the country). The 30% bump up was essentially supposed to be a bonus, but the powers that be at the time didn't feek it was smart to add a bonus on top of locality. For people that live in higher cost of living areas upwards of 25%+ locality, the "pilot bonus" is pretty much non-existant. Other job series get a better FERS retirement. ARC ART's are still at a 1:1 ratio (1% of your highest 3 years for every year of federal service). I believe ATC gets 1.7:1. $100,000 with over 20 years for us is $20,000 per year; for ATC it's $34,000. Quite significant. Their justification was that ATC controllers have a shorter federal career. Um... hello. So do us pilots!

The old ANG is gone. We're pretty damn busy and we're only manned at about 30% full-timers. We've got traditional guardsmen getting 150-200 days of mil duty per year on top of having civilian jobs. It's not a flying club anymore. All of the complaints about ancillary training, additional duties, shoe clerk driven policies, you name it... we live with it also and just imagine trying to keep up with all of that doing it as a "part-time" job.

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