Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[zmoney]

https://mypers.af.mil/app/answers/detail/a_id/34476

Direct link to the AvB PSDM (CAC Required).

[icohftb]

25 minutes ago, ihtfp06 said:

2-yr doesn't protect you from 365.


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But if youre concurrently serving a PCS commitment +/- a few months it wont matter.

Edited June 6, 2017 by icohftb

[RTB]

15 minutes ago, icohftb said:

But if youre concurrently serving a PCS commitment +/- a few months it wont matter.

+ a few months can make all the difference...

 

 

[JQuintana]

In an age when the bonus is supposed to be getting better, it's somehow gotten worse for 11Hs.  From 25K over 9 years to 28K over 5 years.  Fck this shit.

Edited June 6, 2017 by JQuintana

[otsap]

2 hours ago, JQuintana said:

In an age when the bonus is supposed to be getting better, it's somehow gotten worse for 11Hs.  From 25K over 9 years to 28K over 5 years.  Fck this shit.

Yeah that's BS.  It got worse for 11Us as well, from 25K for 9 years to 35K for 5 years.  Seems odd that each "tier" goes down in yearly bonus amount (35k/30k/28k) while also reducing the longest contract term (13y/9y/5y), but then with the 11U/18X/RPA folks they bump the amount up to the max and limit the contract term to 5 years at the longest.  My guess would be that the AF believes it can produce 18X'ers easy and fast enough to make up for losses, which it can.  Therefore it doesn't need the long commitment, as opposed to those who are 11F/M/H/etc, who take years to make.

Still, an 18X will have 7 years in when their 6 year ADSC is up and they are eligible for the bonus, earlier than anyone.  And the longest contract is 5 years, putting them at 12 years when that bonus contract would be complete.  Thats roughly around the time that 11Xs get their first shot at a bonus.  Doesn't look like a plan for long term development of 18X'ers and creating organic leadership from that community.

[Herk Driver]

"The Air Force said airmen whose service commitments expired in fiscal 2016 or earlier will be ineligible, as are those whose commitments expire in fiscal 2018 or later. Airmen who have been recalled under the Voluntary Recall to Active Duty program, inter-service transfers, colonels or colonel-selects, and rated officers who are medically disqualified from aviation service are also ineligible."

Aside from the normal restrictions, notice how there's no early-eligible option (2018) or re-attack options for people taking prior bonuses wanting to re-up.

Seems like chaff that will only profit a very select group of pilots to see who bites instead of a broad reaching attempt to retain talent.

Not saying it's not shrewd, but it's certainly not a massive confidence booster.  Almost like they're trying to find out EXACTLY where the "line" is where they can retain just enough pilots without over-shooting.

I'll be interested to read the actual message.

 

TL;DR

 

The message is finally on myPers.

 

A couple of interesting items.

 

1) short term contracts are no longer for reduced amounts

 

2) specific ability to re-negotiate next year IF the bonus changes...in exchange for one additional year of ADSC from what I remember

 

 

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[Jathor]

3 hours ago, Herk Driver said:

TL;DR

 

The message is finally on myPers.

 

A couple of interesting items.

 

1) short term contracts are no longer for reduced amounts

 

2) specific ability to re-negotiate next year IF the bonus changes...in exchange for one additional year of ADSC from what I remember

 

 

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Ya, the 1 year ADSC was not advertised to previous early eligible last year.  You to can get all the benefits of this new program for the low, low cost of only one more year of your life!  All the early eligible signers get ready for the whoosh of the fence sitters departing.  Not sure if there will be enough of us left to fill that vacuum anymore.

[WheresWaldo]

Heard someone say that you're not eligible if you have a concurrent ADSC like a school or GI Bill, but I can't seem to find this in the verbiage in the PSDM. Can anyone confirm this?

[08Dawg]

20 hours ago, bronxbomber252 said:

https://www.airforcetimes.com/articles/air-force-rolls-out-13-year-455-000-bonuses-for-fighter-pilots

As a 12H, $20,000 for 5 might make sense. Assuming I make major, the timing of my next PCS and the timing of this 5 year one both ADSC's would be expiring would be the same year (roughly) and with the ADSC for my current PCS and my TA, I'd only have about a 6-9month window in which I could punch before that next PCS anyway. So basically I'd get $100,000 for what is effectively a 2 year extension. I have some contemplating to do.

Unless you graduated nav school in FY11 which means your UFT ADSC expires in FY17, you're ineligible.  No other ADSCs count. The 12x bonus is so narrowly focused as to be laughable, and really just a slap in the face.  AFPC reported there are twenty-two total 12Bs elligible, AF wide.  Hooray, getting to do the exact same job for $15K less...

[Swizzle]

The fact that they're considering only core AFSCs as subgroups and not like-RDTM code subgroups harkens to the stupidity of the VSP days when we had too many "pilots"...despite being critically short in certain airframes (AFPC translation = RDTM)...and then masses of KC-10 or other subgroups of "pilots" abandoned ship en mass. Only after approving large portions of certain squadrons did AFPC catch their error and adjust the next Force Shaping programs decisions upon aviators on RDTM codes.

History...its important...

Oh yeah, nice "business case" and nice doing business with you 

[flyusaf83]

Since I'm an 11R, it looks like the bonus won't take me to 20 YOS, now that the max is 5 years. So how does that work? If I take that, it takes me to 17 YOS. So, pay cut for my final 3 years? F that.

What if I take the 1 or 2 year option? Can you sign another bonus at that point?

For me, I'm either staying in to 20, or getting out as soon as my UPT ADSC is up. I either want max airline seniority, or the pension. So if I choose to stay, what's the best way to handle the bonus to get the most out of Uncle Sam?

[FourFans]

55 minutes ago, flyusaf83 said:

Since I'm an 11R, it looks like the bonus won't take me to 20 YOS, now that the max is 5 years. So how does that work? If I take that, it takes me to 17 YOS. So, pay cut for my final 3 years? F that.

What if I take the 1 or 2 year option? Can you sign another bonus at that point?

For me, I'm either staying in to 20, or getting out as soon as my UPT ADSC is up. I either want max airline seniority, or the pension. So if I choose to stay, what's the best way to handle the bonus to get the most out of Uncle Sam?

I feel your pain.  I only had the option for a 5 year bonus that I took 2 years ago, and it only takes me to 17 YOS as well.  Later, they offered extension to 20 years flying service but I didn't take that because I frankly don't trust the USAF and I really don't want to go 365.  Right now, if you can punch out at your 10 year UPT ADSC, take the bonus that best matches but doesn't overrun your ADSC and then I'd pull the handles ASAP.

I have sneaking suspicion that my failure to commit to the company line and sign for the extended bonus may have contributed to being passed over this year as a career ops pilot/WO.  I'm already seeing the writing on the wall.  No chance for further bonus, and I'll be lucky if I get back to line flying.  Right my best outcome is to become the grumpy squadron WO in the squadron and ride out my last 3 years without a bonus.  You don't want to be in this boat.

Either take the full bonus and accept that you'll be getting a 365, or get out as soon as you can.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, flyusaf83 said:

What if I take the 1 or 2 year option? Can you sign another bonus at that point?

According to Mypers: 

• Aviators signing one-year contracts in FY2017 will be eligible to sign a contract in FY2018 upon expiration of their FY2017 contract based on the tiered amount offered to their respective Core ID communities. Aviators should realize that contract offerings will vary from year-to-year. There is no guarantee that FY2018 offerings will be better than or equal to FY2017 offerings
• Aviators signing two-year contracts in FY2017 will be eligible to sign a contract in FY2019 upon expiration of their FY2017 contract based on the tiered amount offered to their respective Core ID communities. Aviators should realize that contract offerings will vary from year-to-year. There is no guarantee that FY2019 offerings will be better than or equal to FY2017 offerings

That said, I fully expect the subsequent contracts to be for a lesser dollar amount (unless the Air Force starts to get really desperate).  I see the one and two year options as good deals for those who aren't ready to get out yet, but aren't planning on staying for an AD retirement.  It sucks that you aren't being offered the 9 year option, but for the Air Force, it makes sense.  If they've got you for 17, they know they've got you to 20 AD or in the ARC.

[NKAWTG]

My reading saw a couple of nuggets

1. If you signed the early bonus last year, you can upgrade to the new dollar amount by adding an extra year of commitment.  It doesn't say one way or the other if that extra year comes with a bonus payment.  I would assume it does, but it doesn't explicitly say that.

2. If you already signed a bonus, you're under that contract, no way to upgrade.

 

Options are nice, but I can't see this convincing a fence sitter to stay.  All the other promises about manning, 365s, pairing additional duties back, etc, need to be kept for a couple of years to build the trust back.

 

 

[Motofalcon]

8 hours ago, WheresWaldo said:

Heard someone say that you're not eligible if you have a concurrent ADSC like a school or GI Bill, but I can't seem to find this in the verbiage in the PSDM. Can anyone confirm this?

From the PSDM:

1. Eligible Officers:

a. Active duty pilots (11X), RPA pilots (11U/12U/13U/18X) and CSOs (12B/12F/12R/12S) who have completed their UFT ADSC in FY2017.

i. Other ADSCs do not affect AvB eligibility 

So I read that all they care about is that your UPT/UNT ADSC expires in 2017. Other ADSCs (school, GI Bill, PCS) do not disqualify you. Which seems (to me) that the 1 year can be a no-brainer for some. 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Motofalcon said:

From the PSDM:

1. Eligible Officers:

a. Active duty pilots (11X), RPA pilots (11U/12U/13U/18X) and CSOs (12B/12F/12R/12S) who have completed their UFT ADSC in FY2017.

i. Other ADSCs do not affect AvB eligibility 

So I read that all they care about is that your UPT/UNT ADSC expires in 2017. Other ADSCs (school, GI Bill, PCS) do not disqualify you. Which seems (to me) that the 1 year can be a no-brainer for some. 

That is correct. e.g let's say you have ADSC for UPT ending FY2017, but you accomplished the TEB to your kids/spouse and acquired an ADSC expiring in FY2019, You will still be eligible for the bonus.

Big Blue is interested in completion of your UPT ADSC.

nice option what Fourfans said: take a bonus that aligns with your longest ADSC. 

You are in until your longest one anyway with little chance of punching >6 months left (based on what nearly every AFPC functional is recommending for PC packages) on your ADSC for Palace Chase.

[nsplayr]

You would think if the crisis was so urgent they would open bonus eligibility to uncommitted free-agents, e.g. pilots who passed on the bonus previously or CSOs not previously eligible.

I know plenty of those folks, pilots in particular, who are only remaining in the AF until their good deal location/job/etc. stops or they run out a specific non-UFT ADSC, at which time they are overwhelmingly likely to punch unless they luck into or work a good follow-on.

[Termy]

It is also apparent that the following announcement would hold more people than the bonus:

"No more 365's.  Period.  For anyone."

 

[Duck]

This is awesome. Now AF can say "bonus takers are up xx%. We are solving the problems, people trust us again!" When the only new people signing have a 2 year PCS ADSC or TEB. Excellent work AF.


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[RTB]

55 minutes ago, Termy said:

It is also apparent that the following announcement would hold more people than the bonus:

"No more 365's.  Period.  For anyone."

 

Big Blue would be smart to kill all non-vol 365s and offer targeted bonuses for 365 volunteers. Kind of like the airlines do for oversold flights. 

Who wants a Baghdad 365 for $15k?  No takers?  How about $20k?  $30?  And so on. 

Take the non vol 365 heinosity off the table, increase flight pay significantly for all flyers while also reducing home station queep and they might have a chance to keep a few folks. Someone who wants the cash will eventually bite on the 365 as the dollar amount goes up.  FAR cheaper than dumping cash at dudes serving concurrent ADSCs. 

Edited June 7, 2017 by RTB

[Guest]

Big Blue would be smart to kill all non-vol 365s and offer targeted bonuses for 365 volunteers. Kind of like the airlines do for oversold flights. 
Who wants a Baghdad 365 for $15k?  No takers?  How about $20k?  $30?  And so on. 
Take the non vol 365 heinosity off the table, increase flight pay significantly for all flyers while also reducing home station queep and they might have a chance to keep a few folks. Someone who wants the cash will eventually bite on the 365 as the dollar amount goes up.  FAR cheaper than dumping cash at dudes serving concurrent ADSCs. 

That goes against the spirit of our second core value!!!!


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[icohftb]

1 hour ago, nsplayr said:

You would think if the crisis was so urgent they would open bonus eligibility to uncommitted free-agents, e.g. pilots who passed on the bonus previously or CSOs not previously eligible.

I know plenty of those folks, pilots in particular, who are only remaining in the AF until their good deal location/job/etc. stops or they run out a specific non-UFT ADSC, at which time they are overwhelmingly likely to punch unless they luck into or work a good follow-on.

Last 2 years they offered uncommitted eligible pilots a bonus option. Guess they fixed the shortage in those year groups since then... 

[Jetpilot]

Can someone confirm that the AvB eligibility only applies to those whose pilot training expires in FY 2017?  I assume most of these people already made up their minds on the original bonus and are already either staying/leaving. Can we not expect seriously low take rates because of this situation?  In essence, the AvB is targeting 4 months of people who may not have an extended commitment. 

[Guest]

Last 2 years they offered uncommitted eligible pilots a bonus option. Guess they fixed the shortage in those year groups since then... 

More likely there aren't enough uncommitted eligibles left to have much of an impact. By adopting a now-or-never strategy, Big Blue may ensnare more.


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[icohftb]

1 hour ago, ihtfp06 said:

More likely there aren't enough uncommitted eligibles left to have much of an impact. By adopting a now-or-never strategy, Big Blue may ensnare more.


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Funny thing is that i would have actually taken it this year. And with the reserves offering a 1-3 yr bonus that i would have been eligible for, i would have gone that route. I think this is gonna convince even more people to switch over.