Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[herkbum]

Gonna take a wild guess and say he probably meant FAO?

No, he meant BAO-Bilateral Affairs Officer. It’s an SPP position and it’s awesome. Similar to FAO, but doesn’t have all of the training requirements. I was one for 2 years from 2008-2010. One of the coolest things I’ve ever done. I had an office in the Embassy and an office in the Ministry of Defense. I travelled thru out the country and it rocked. Met my wife, who was also working in the Embassy. Can’t say enough good things about being a BAO.


Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

[SocialD]

9 hours ago, herkbier said:

BAO?

What Herkbum said, and for clarification, SPP = state partnership for peace (google it).  Of course it's highly dependent upon what country your state is partnered with, on whether it's a good deal or not.  Ours happens to be in one of my favorite cities in Eastern Europe.  If I hadn't got hired at the airlines when I did, I would have been lobbying hard for that gig.  As always timing is key.  

[herkbum]

What Herkbum said, and for clarification, SPP = state partnership for peace (google it).  Of course it's highly dependent upon what country your state is partnered with, on whether it's a good deal or not.  Ours happens to be in one of my favorite cities in Eastern Europe.  If I hadn't got hired at the airlines when I did, I would have been lobbying hard for that gig.  As always timing is key.  

We are Eastern Europe as well, NATO and EU members. And actually SPP=State Partnership Program. The Peace part went away in the 90s. New focus and most recent additions have been in Africa. Have fun with that.


Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

[Bode]

For the lazy peeps out there.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

 

[sling-it-17]

Haven’t checked myPers in a while, but does anyone have intel on when the 19’ bonus is dropping? As i understand it no changes from last year but one would like to think it would drop sooner due to the NDSA is already signed. Crazy talk i know!

[SFG]

3 hours ago, sling-it-17 said:

Haven’t checked myPers in a while, but does anyone have intel on when the 19’ bonus is dropping? As i understand it no changes from last year but one would like to think it would drop sooner due to the NDSA is already signed. Crazy talk i know!

They'll get 9 more months out of you if they wait until July.

[sling-it-17]

Haha! I’ve got some slop in there before hitting 20 so that’s not a factor. If they get it out early, i could get another 30k for 3 months over 20. That would be worth it, but i doubt i have to worry about that happening.....

[sixpack]

Any chance the 1 year option will come back for FY19?  When will the FY19 AvB come out anyways?  Would love to milk some more money out of the AF before I retire.  

[jazzdude]

Hopefully they bump up what the offer to 11Ms, up to the $35k they are authorized to, instead of the $30k they offered last year. It'll be interesting to see what they end up offering, but I'm not holding my breath for info anytime soon.

Also curious about the rumored professional pay, and how talking the bonus this year would affect flight pay/professional pay if they change it in the future.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

[Hunter Rose]

On 10/14/2018 at 4:27 PM, jazzdude said:

Also curious about the rumored professional pay, and how talking the bonus this year would affect flight pay/professional pay if they change it in the future.
 

 

Quite frankly, HAF needs to get off its ass and start throwing money at the problem.

Pilot losses are starting to go exponential. We had a net loss of 124 pilots in FY17...in FY18 we had a net loss of 227 pilots...that’s almost double the amount walking out the door in a single year.

All the flowery speeches and Aircrew Retention Task Force efforts on QoL improvements have  utterly failed.

Why not at least try solving (or at least easing) the problem with money? 

[sling-it-17]

Because for a few years pilots have said it’s not about the money. Because apparently you can’t get both: better QoL/QoS and a better bonus. I never understood this....but that was how the problem was framed and people took the bait.

[pilotguy]

I’ve never understood the “it’s not about the money” argument. 

A 6 month deployment is way more tolerable when you’re making 250+ a year.  So are alllll the other problems everyone complains about. Same with the wife’s problems....

Close the pay gap with the airlines and you keep a BUNCH of pilots. But couple the known aircrew issues with literally half the pay of a 3rd year airline dude/dudette and the AF doesn’t have a chance. Not sure why this is so hard. 

Edited October 17, 2018 by pilotguy

[gearhog]

7 minutes ago, pilotguy said:

I’ve never understood the “it’s not about the money” argument. 

A 6 month deployment is way more tolerable when you’re making 250 a year.  So are alllll the other problems everyone complains about. Same with the wife’s problems

I can totally understand the "it's not about the money" argument, even though I don't believe many are saying it.

If someone wants something out of life that the Air Force cannot give them (e.g. control, freedom, location, accommodation of family special needs, etc.), they may not be willing to compromise merely for more money. There are some things you can't pay certain people to tolerate.

The vast majority of people I know who have left/are leaving the AF say "It's not only about the money."

[matmacwc]

There are more AGR billets than takers right now, you just have to be willing to move to DC or some backwater staff, or not fly.

[pawnman]

5 hours ago, torqued said:

I can totally understand the "it's not about the money" argument, even though I don't believe many are saying it.

If someone wants something out of life that the Air Force cannot give them (e.g. control, freedom, location, accommodation of family special needs, etc.), they may not be willing to compromise merely for more money. There are some things you can't pay certain people to tolerate.

The vast majority of people I know who have left/are leaving the AF say "It's not only about the money."

There's a big gap between "it's not about the money" and "it's not ONLY about the money".

[Sprkt69]

From what I’ve seen, “It’s not about the money” argument is from people that think the AF can change the toxic $hit show it’s become. The argument of “show me the money” is typically from the people that want airline pay to put up with the BS.

[Bigred]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 8:19 PM, Sprkt69 said:

From what I’ve seen, “It’s not about the money” argument is from people that think the AF can change the toxic $hit show it’s become. The argument of “show me the money” is typically from the people that want airline pay to put up with the BS.

It's definitely an interesting point of view, and I'd hazard to guess that if a guy was getting paid $250k to fly fighters there'd be less of a pilot shortage. Just my 2 cents.

[pilotguy]

It’s simple for me...

As it stands I’m 100% getting out when my time is up

If I could make 250K (approx year 3 money at an airline) in the AF I’m 100% staying in.

No, the problems don’t go away, they just can be overlooked if my time is valued properly monetarily.

Id venture to guess that most people would feel the same way. 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2018 by pilotguy

[jice]

3 hours ago, pilotguy said:

It’s simple for me...

As it stands I’m 100% getting out when my time is up

If I could make 250K (approx year 3 money at an airline) in the AF I’m 100% staying in.

No, the problems don’t go away, they just can be overlooked if my time is valued properly monetarily.

Id venture to guess that most people would feel the same way. 

 

 

Spot on.

Furthermore, the leaders who say “stay in because your country needs you” just don’t understand the dynamics. I’m 100% of my family’s father and husband population. They need me more. Until the situation is better (or at least similar) for the family when folks stay in the Air Force, most will choose to get out. That means the money has to be close.

It’s programmed into us genetically. Risk of death? Bad. Provide for kids so that they can continue to spread 50% of my genes? Good. Keeping the wife happy? See risk of death. 

It’s not selfish to pursue greener pastures. It’s selfish to stay in to satisfy ‘quality of service’ at the expense of a family.  There’s always volunteering for the Boys and Girls Club or Coast Guard auxiliary... on my brand new 30’ boat.

(Lots of caveats: some families value that quality of service as a unit, some people are psychopaths, some people don’t have families, some people didn’t bald and bloat at 35 and can get new families, etc.)

Edited October 20, 2018 by jice
Grammar

[Majestik Møøse]

6 hours ago, jice said:

It’s programmed into us genetically. Risk of death? Bad.

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

[pawnman]

13 minutes ago, Majestik Møøse said:

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

Flying an ALR extreme mission at least comes with a clear intent and a sense of satisfaction.

[jice]

21 minutes ago, Majestik Møøse said:

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

Totally agree!

And here’s the REALLY funny part: in many circumstances that appears to be biologically programmed as well.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_equation

ALR extreme mission (with clear intent) = huge payoff for the ‘tribe’ = massive opportunity for propogation of similar genetic material (over the ‘tribe’ we might be sacrificing ourselves to destroy)

Sitting in a faceless bureaucracy = unhappy mate = no benefit at all to my genetic material’s propogation (through my own reproduction or opportunity for the tribe.) 

As it turns out, for beings built to fvck, it often comes down to fvcking!

(Again lots of caveats [and philosophical issues not to touch], but the issue is much more complicated than changing individual minds over and over again. In any case, more money wouldn’t hurt a bit...) 

[SFG]

On March 13, 2018 at 2:58 PM, akang2006 said:

Finally got my CMS case (18 Jan 2018) for AvIP adjudicated. Despite the DFAS pay table showing $1K/mo available for over 10 years aviation service, DFAS abides by the Oct 2017 AF memo showing $700/mo. USAF is leaving $300/mo on the table when it could pay the $1K. No reason, just cause. 

DFAS updated the 2018 pay tables to reflect that services may elect to pay less. That statement wasn’t in the initial release from DFAS in early 2018. 

Something else I just discovered that happened under the table late in 2016...

Even if you have completed all your gates, which previously would have entitled you to AvIP through 25 years of aviation service, you will no longer receive AvIP ("Flight Pay") if you are in an assignment outside of aviation for more than 48 consecutive months.

Exceptions are Joint Duty Assignment List assignments, resident PME or AF-funded education programs, or positions requiring an aeronatical rating.

The more you know...

 

Edited December 15, 2018 by Klepto

[Champ Kind]

Something else I just discovered that happened under the table late in 2016...
Even if you have completed all your gates, which previously would have entitled you to AvIP through 25 years of aviation service, you will no longer receive AvIP ("Flight Pay") if you are in an assignment outside of aviation for more than 48 consecutive months.
Exceptions are Joint Duty Assignment List assignments, resident PME or AF-funded education programs, or positions requiring an aeronatical rating.
The more you know...
Also it sounds like Professional Pay is off the table.
 

So why even bother with “gate months” anymore then? Makes zero sense.

[sling-it-17]

So anybody heard any updates? Someone on a FB group who works at A1 said the FY19 info would be out before the holiday and then the website open on Jan 7th to process applicants. I know it won’t be up beyond 35k but curious if they change some tiers or options. 

 

I understand a lot of people don’t want to take it, but some do. So any info would be helpful.