Aviation Continuation Pay (ACP - The Bonus)

[nunya]

3 minutes ago, ihtfp06 said:

Could our leadership be any shittier?

$100/mo taxable raise isn't going to change anyone's calculus.  They know this.  They've already made it abundantly clear that their plan is recruiting, not retention.

[BashiChuni]

1 hour ago, nunya said:

$100/mo taxable raise isn't going to change anyone's calculus.  They know this.  They've already made it abundantly clear that their plan is recruiting high school seniors to be F-35 wing[insert gender pronoun] in 6 months, not retention.

FIFY

[flyusaf83]

2 hours ago, nunya said:

$100/mo taxable raise isn't going to change anyone's calculus.  They know this.  They've already made it abundantly clear that their plan is recruiting, not retention.

What’s that word that management always uses as an excuse to decrease morale?  Like when my squadron was told not to go TDY to fun places because it looks bad for us to have a good time on the road?

Oh yeah.  Optics.

It goes both ways AF.  I’m the midst of a pilot retention crisis, not paying everything that Congress authorizes you too?

Bad optics.

[nunya]

Optics only matter if you care about second and third order effects.  

[GKinnear]

13 hours ago, nunya said:

Optics only matter if you care about second and third order effects.  

If we can get the messaging right, then we will drive the optics to capitalize on the second and third order effects...

[nunya]

That's what I think is being missed.  They don't care about optics or messaging.  They care about manning metrics.  They've given up trying to keep you in. Those that want to do 20 and school and CC and NAF and 365s and XYZ will - raise or no raise.  Those that don't, won't.  They decided they can't buy retention so they're not trying very hard.  

If Maj Twelve Years is pissed and bails over $100, they don't care.  They had already written him off anyway.  They'll replace him with Lt Lost Way.  Whether it's a suitable replacement in the real world is also not their concern.  The sooner we realize how they view their Majs, the less offended you'll be at the slights.  

No well run business would think they can replace their middle managers with hourly unskilled labor, but Uncle Sugar is no well run business.  

[Jetpilot]

Any updates on what the status is of the FY18 pilot bonus?  Seems crazy to have a bunch of pissed off “free agents”.  

[cragspider]

35 minutes ago, Jetpilot said:

Any updates on what the status is of the FY18 pilot bonus?  Seems crazy to have a bunch of pissed off “free agents”.  

I doubt it, you give them to much credit.  I would expect to see it by Jun but at this rate who knows anymore. 

[Gazmo]

This is all f#cked up. I am getting random backpaid LES's in the ANG for $5.33 per pay period (AFTP/RUTA). I went from $650 to $1,000 by jumping from 6+ to 10+ 1 Oct 2017. The funny part is I got $28 incentive pay ($840/30) on an AFTP that paid out a few weeks ago. $840 was the old 14 year incentive pay. I wouldn't hit the 14-year Aviation service pay until next fall and besides that, that $840 incentive pay doesn't even exist anymore. Until the new policy I was in the 6-year club getting $650 or $21.67 per pay period. If they're back pay me $5.33 per pay . Based on this change I should be getting $11.63 back pay for each AFTP/RUTA. Looks like I'm going to have to talk to my HARM and finance tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

[pawnman]

On 1/27/2018 at 2:22 PM, nunya said:

$100/mo taxable raise isn't going to change anyone's calculus.  They know this.  They've already made it abundantly clear that their plan is recruiting, not retention.

Who do the recruits talk to before signing up?

[nunya]

2 hours ago, pawnman said:

Who do the recruits talk to before signing up?

Sure, 1 or 2 may not join because of your/our bitching.  Probably your stories will steer your own son away.  But most wannabes don't have personal access to a disgruntled military pilot or are so enamored that they don't care, so they run blindly to the bright blue light.  Once again, we overestimate the impact of our disgruntlement.  The Pentagon just doesn't care.

[Duck]

If you would have told me as an 18 year old how bad the AF sucked, I would have just said to myself that you must have not been a very good pilot/officer and it won’t happen to me. Unfortunate but true.

[BONE WSO]

14 hours ago, Gazmo said:

This is all f#cked up. I am getting random backpaid LES's in the ANG for $5.33 per pay period (AFTP/RUTA). I went from $650 to $1,000 by jumping from 6+ to 10+ 1 Oct 2017. The funny part is I got $28 incentive pay ($840/30) on an AFTP that paid out a few weeks ago. $840 was the old 14 year incentive pay. I wouldn't hit the 14-year Aviation service pay until next fall and besides that, that $840 incentive pay doesn't even exist anymore. Until the new policy I was in the 6-year club getting $650 or $21.67 per pay period. If they're back pay me $5.33 per pay . Based on this change I should be getting $11.63 back pay for each AFTP/RUTA. Looks like I'm going to have to talk to my HARM and finance tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

I'm an ANG guy (on ADOS orders) and mine is still messed up too. I have been getting random LES's for $175, the 2 week difference between my old rate at $650 and new rate at $1000. They have given me a few of these checks, but skipped over the period of Oct 1-15 and the old rate still shows up on my standard LES.

Finance will not be able to fix it for you. If you look back a few pages, my finance put a ticket in for me and they were told by DFAS that the issue is being worked service-wide and to close the ticket. Finance doesn't have the ability/authority to pay you what you are owed in this situation.

[Gazmo]

What date is AvIP based off of?

[pilotguy]

Date you started UPT

[Scooter14]

On 2/1/2018 at 11:40 AM, pilotguy said:

Date you started UPT

More specifically the date you started aviation service, so if you were a navigator for 8 years and then went to UPT, all that time counts.  

[Runr6730]

Just took a survey posted to a MAF Facebook group by someone who’s supposedly in the aircrew crisis task force. According to the survey, the proposed “fly-only” criteria are as follows:

1) Eligible for 10-13 year Majors, requires a commitment to 20 years 

2) Receive current aviation bonus

3) Limited length (ineligible for 365s) and type of deployments (flying-related only)

4) Eligible for specific flying-related jobs (Stan/Eval, training, etc) at all levels

5) Extended time on-station to 4-5 years

6) Eligible for advanced aviation courses (WIC, AIS, TPS, etc)

7) IDE/SDE optional and by correspondence only

8) Ineligible for promotion above O-5 and only compete for promotion against other fly-only officers, with promotion based on sustained superior performance as an aviator

9) Pilots can return to the traditional track NLT 13 years TIS

I may be missing a few smaller things, but those were the main points. 

[SocialD]

On 2/1/2018 at 3:28 PM, BONE WSO said:

I'm an ANG guy (on ADOS orders) and mine is still messed up too.

Deployed on title-10 and my flight pay is still fucked up!  But not to worry, they worked expeditiously to take back an overpayment due to their fuck up.  It's a good rehack of my distain for being full time.  

Edited February 5, 2018 by SocialD

[flyusaf83]

4 hours ago, Runr6730 said:

Just took a survey posted to a MAF Facebook group by someone who’s supposedly in the aircrew crisis task force. According to the survey, the proposed “fly-only” criteria are as follows:

1) Eligible for 10-13 year Majors, requires a commitment to 20 years 

2) Receive current aviation bonus

3) Limited length (ineligible for 365s) and type of deployments (flying-related only)

4) Eligible for specific flying-related jobs (Stan/Eval, training, etc) at all levels

5) Extended time on-station to 4-5 years

6) Eligible for advanced aviation courses (WIC, AIS, TPS, etc)

7) IDE/SDE optional and by correspondence only

8) Ineligible for promotion above O-5 and only compete for promotion against other fly-only officers, with promotion based on sustained superior performance as an aviator

9) Pilots can return to the traditional track NLT 13 years TIS

I may be missing a few smaller things, but those were the main points. 

The devil would be in the details... 

- What is a “flying-related”deployment?  Is working at the Deid CAOC or the Al-Dhafra  safety office  “flying-related”?  Or are talking about actual flying deployments?

- What would the flying track 0-5 promotion rate be? Would passed over O-4s be guaranteed continuation?

 

[Hermey]

7 hours ago, Runr6730 said:

Just took a survey posted to a MAF Facebook group by someone who’s supposedly in the aircrew crisis task force. According to the survey, the proposed “fly-only” criteria are as follows:

1) Eligible for 10-13 year Majors, requires a commitment to 20 years 

2) Receive current aviation bonus

3) Limited length (ineligible for 365s) and type of deployments (flying-related only)

4) Eligible for specific flying-related jobs (Stan/Eval, training, etc) at all levels

5) Extended time on-station to 4-5 years

6) Eligible for advanced aviation courses (WIC, AIS, TPS, etc)

7) IDE/SDE optional and by correspondence only

8) Ineligible for promotion above O-5 and only compete for promotion against other fly-only officers, with promotion based on sustained superior performance as an aviator

9) Pilots can return to the traditional track NLT 13 years TIS

I may be missing a few smaller things, but those were the main points. 

Also took it recently....seems like the only thing you’d gain is “flying related jobs/deployment” only and the ability to stiff arm school. You trade a 7-10 year commitment for it...like signing up for a UPT commitment all over again. As mentioned that seems way to subjective to me! Doubt the Sq/OG/Wg is going to care if you are “fly only” versus traditional when they need FGO bodies for their queep. No thanks, I’ll keep my ability to 7 day opt an air advisor role or crappy assignment and take my talent/training elsewhere when active duty stops making sense for me.

[matmacwc]

16 hours ago, Scooter14 said:

More specifically the date you started aviation service, so if you were a navigator for 8 years and then went to UPT, all that time counts.  

Even more specifically the day you hit the flight line in UPT.  I thought I was screwed out of a month but it isn’t the day you started UPT.

[Guest]

Even more specifically the day you hit the flight line in UPT.  I thought I was screwed out of a month but it isn’t the day you started UPT.

That’s incorrect, mine is the day I started phase 1.

[pawnman]

1 hour ago, ihtfp06 said:

That’s incorrect, mine is the day I started phase 1.

2

Mine is my first day of academics at Pensacola.

[bronxbomber252]

2
Mine is my first day of academics at Pensacola.

3

[MooseAg03]

16 hours ago, Runr6730 said:

Just took a survey posted to a MAF Facebook group by someone who’s supposedly in the aircrew crisis task force. According to the survey, the proposed “fly-only” criteria are as follows:

1) Eligible for 10-13 year Majors, requires a commitment to 20 years 

2) Receive current aviation bonus

3) Limited length (ineligible for 365s) and type of deployments (flying-related only)

4) Eligible for specific flying-related jobs (Stan/Eval, training, etc) at all levels

5) Extended time on-station to 4-5 years

6) Eligible for advanced aviation courses (WIC, AIS, TPS, etc)

7) IDE/SDE optional and by correspondence only

8) Ineligible for promotion above O-5 and only compete for promotion against other fly-only officers, with promotion based on sustained superior performance as an aviator

9) Pilots can return to the traditional track NLT 13 years TIS

I may be missing a few smaller things, but those were the main points. 

Took the survey today.

1) They're targeting the wrong year group. They should be trying to convince mid to senior Capts that they want to stay past commitment, not change the minds of those with a foot out the door.

2) Current aviation bonus is too low.

3) "Tactical" and flying deployments.  This means you're still up for that 179 to the CAOC.

4) Flying related jobs at all levels....including staff.  They'll get around this by keeping you attached somewhere that you'll maybe fly once per quarter.

5) 4-5 years isn't long enough.  If you want a 13 year Major, let him pick a base of choice and stay there until 20.  That's homesteading.

6 & 7) Good

8) "Fly only" in zone to Lt Col would be 16 years which by my calculations is 2 years behind everyone else.  Why penalize the guy who wants to fly by making him promote later?  I only looked at the DOR chart for about a minute, so I might be wrong here.

9) Pilots who return to traditional track are still locked in for 20 years.  

Some good ideas here, but the biggest issue is that these "guarantees" are still dependent on big blue keeping its word.  We all know where that leads.

Edited February 5, 2018 by MooseAg03