USAF Weapons School (WIC) info

[Champ Kind]

What airframes usually attend? Obviously the fighter/bomber guys go, but I've also seen Helo guys wearing the patches. (CSAR guys I figured). Do Tac Airlift crews ever go? Just wondering.....

Thanks!

[Guest Hoser]

The Weapons School's squadrons include: A-10, AC-130, B-1, B-2, B-52, F-15C, F-15E, F-16C, F-117, HH-60, MC-130, MH-53, Command and Control Operations, Intelligence, Space, and Support.

The school also conducts extensive technical off-station training and liaison with combat air forces for the B-1 at Dyess AFB TX, B-2 at Whiteman AFB MO, B-52 at Barksdale AFB LA, F-117 at Holloman AFB NM and SOF at Hurlburt Field FL.

Here's the website with the above info:

USAF Weapons School

[Guest rotorhead]

I'm sure I'll leave someone out here and offend them, and fully expect someone to jump in to correct my post:

The USAF Weapons School, formerly the Fighter Weapons School, is for CAF assets. It includes A-10, B-1, B-2, B-52, F-15C, F-15E, F-16C, F-117 and HH-60 aircraft. Recently, other folks have wanted in on the patch, such as AFSOC, which now has it's own branch office at Hurlburt for AC-130, MC-130, and MH-53. There are also other branch offices at Dyess, Barksdale, Whiteman, and Holloman. In addition to CAF flight ops, there are divisions for Command and Control Operations, Intelligence and Space weapons.

Not to be slighted, the MAF has wanted in on the action, with their own schools, such as the USAF Mobility Weapons School, with Combat Aerial Delivery School, and Combat Aircrew Tactics School.

Long story short, the USAFWS patch is for CAF assets, but just about everyone in the USAF ops world now has a "weapons school".

[M2]

Here are the ones that I know...

Former Weapons School Division = New Weapons School Squadron

Command and Control Operations Division = 8th Weapons Squadron

Special Operations Forces Division = 14th Weapons Squadron

F-16 Division = 16th Weapons Squadron

F-15E Division = 17th Weapons Squadron

Intelligence Division = 19th Weapons Squadron

HH-60G Division = 34th Weapons Squadron

Support Division = 57th Weapons Support Squadron

A-10 Division = 66th Weapons Squadron

B-1 Division = 77th Weapons Squadron

Space Division = 328th Weapons Squadron

B-52 Division = 340th Weapons Squadron

F-15 Division = 433rd Weapons Squadron

KC-135 Division = 509th Weapons Squadron

B-2 Division = 715th Weapons Squadron

C-17 Division = 57th Weapons Squadron

Don't know the F-117 squadron...

Cheers! M2

[Guest goldbar03]

On an unrelated note... what's the time in service restriction for attending a weapons school? Do guys that get FAIP'd or were prior AFSCs/enlisted have a chance to go or does the timeframe prevent them from attending?

[Guest bruno]

I wondered if anyone could tell me how easy or difficult it is for a guy to go to weapons school straight out of intel school? Also how long is the school and would it make it easier or harder to get that commander recommendation for UPT with that schooling? or does that lock you into intel for a few more years?

Thanks gang

[ClearedHot]

Actually the AFSOC AC-130, MH-53, and MC-130 courses, syllabus and instructors fall under the 57th Wing at Nellis. Collectively they are called the SOF division, and are offically known as the 14th Weapons Squadron, a tenant unit at Hurlburt.

The KC-135 and C-17 courses, syllabus, and instrcutors are not a part of the USAF Weapons School. They belong to AMC and thier students interact with the USAF Weapons School WUGs only during CORE academics and the Mission Employment exercise at the end of the course.

[Guest Hoser]

goldbar03,

On an unrelated note... what's the time in service restriction for attending a weapons school? Do guys that get FAIP'd or were prior AFSCs/enlisted have a chance to go or does the timeframe prevent them from attending?

I know there is a time in service restriction and I know it is waiverable, but I don't know what the exact number is off the top of my cranium.

I do know of 2 guys that were FAIPS and went to the F-15E WIC. I chatted with one of them and it preaty much turns out that you have to do at least one upgrade per year, so 2-FLUG your 1st year, 4-FLUG in the 2nd, and IP in the 3rd, and then get the 50 hours (I think) needed to apply, assuming you get a full 3 years in the squadron in the first place.

So yes it can be done, but the more common path is getting an ops-to-ops assignment, and getting accepted during your 2nd tour.

Hoser

[Guest Ragansundowner]

Do you apply for USAFWS like you would TPS, or are the best pilots assigned to the training from a certain squadron? Just curious how they decide which pilots to send.

-R.S.

[HerkDerka]

Originally posted by PhlashNU04:

What airframes usually attend? Obviously the fighter/bomber guys go, but I've also seen Helo guys wearing the patches. (CSAR guys I figured). Do Tac Airlift crews ever go? Just wondering.....

Thanks!

Regarding your Tac Airlift question, yes we do have a weapons school. CADS - Combat Aerial Delivery School. The Patch says USAF Mobility Weapons School.

HD

[Toro]

Originally posted by Ragansundowner:

Do you apply for USAFWS like you would TPS, or are the best pilots assigned to the training from a certain squadron?

Anybody can apply, but generally only those who are truly qualified will do so. The applications are collected within the squadron semi-annually and the squadron weapons officer (a WIC grad) will review them for recommendation and push them up the chain as necessary.

[Guest deweygcc]

Not to offend , but how does a c-17 and a KC-135 get a weapons patch? I guess I dont have a ? about the helos because they DO have gunners, but how can a MWS without the ability to THUMP, compete for weapons school? Do the KC guys get like a quickest boom trophy?

[ClearedHot]

Not all of the players at the Weapons School put iron on target, but all are a vital part of that effort. CCO has Weapons School courses for the several support frames like JSTARS and AWACS that are vital to the fight.

The tanker and transport folks are not part of the USAF Weapons School. They left in 2002 after differences over control of syllabus. As a result, they have aseperate course that is managaed by AMC. Different patch, different course, same concept, produce the best instructors possible.

[scoobs]

How do you become an instructor at Weapons School.

[ClearedHot]

Originally posted by scoobs:

How do you become an instructor at Weapons School.

Typically, graduates will go back to a squadron for at least a year. After that many will follow a normal progression up to wing level jobs. The flesh peddlers will normally nominate potential instructors to the school 2-3 years after graduation.

Instructing at the Weapons School was second only to flying in combat. I worked harder and played harder that at any other point in my career.

[Mild]

What's the chances for a FAIP that was casual for a year prior to UPT (so a 5.5 - 6 yr Capt wingman) to make the reqs for weapons school, IP w/50 IP hours in that airframe? I know its small shot, but one that I want to takeadn push for. Any success stories are welcomed for any encouragement that I can gain. Thanks.

[ClearedHot]

Mild,

There is always a chance. There were a lot of guys going through a few years ago that were banked for three years early on.

A big factor in determining who gets picked is the recommendations you take to the selection board.

If it is something you are really interested in, sit down with your the DO and your squadron Weapons Officer and see if you guys can build a road map to get you there.

As with everything in the USAF, there are waivers for everything. Good Luck.

[scoobs]

Do you get a chance to fly different airframes as an instructor or just what you where flying in the squad?Also after your instructor do you back to squadron?

Thanks

[ClearedHot]

Originally posted by scoobs:

Do you get a chance to fly different airframes as an instructor or just what you where flying in the squad?Also after your instructor do you back to squadron?

Thanks

Weapons School Instructors fly and instruct in their primary MDS only. While at Nellis you may will have chance to fly in the tub with the Vipers and Light Gray's, in the pit with the Mudhens, strap hang with the Buff's, or even an AC-130. A great chance to learn more about the other systems out there.

When you graduate you payback is expected to be at the squadron level. After a tour as an instructor at the Weapons School, most guys will go to school (IDE) or off to a staff tour.

[scoobs]

Thanks for all the great replys.What kind of schools can one expect to go to?

[ClearedHot]

20-30% of Mid-level officers (Majors), will go to Air Command and Staff College, AFIT, or a similar school form another service. The opportunity is increasing with slots to get masters degrees at major universities.

I went to ACSC last year, then got picked up for another year of school at the USMC School of Advanced Warfighting, I will probalby go to the Air Staff for a two years, then back to fly.

[Ferg]

Looking through 11-415, I can't find specifics on a maximum age or rank. The only thing I could find was

5.6.1.1. Selection Board Waivers. Selection board waivers include TAFCSD, rank, minimum MDS/specialty experience, instructor qualification date, and total hours in PAA, as defined by MDS/specialty criteria in the nomination message. Waiver requests for individuals exceeding the TAFCSD time are evaluated on a case-by-case basis.

But I couldn't find anything elsewhere in the pub that mentions a maximum TAFCSD (Total Active Federal Commissioned Service Date) or rank (did a pdf search). Does this mean that every nomination message sets a different requirement?

[ClearedHot]

Does this mean that every nomination message sets a different requirement?

Yes....and they always consider waivers...

[RASH]

Each MWS sets its own minimum requirements (age/rank, hours, etc) which are spelled out in the initial board message. As ClearedHot said--they all accept waivers, but whether you get one is again dependent upon MWS and number of others applying to the school. PM if you want more info...

[koonunga_hill]

Good Afternoon All,

I would like to know some things you can do to set yourself up to go to weapons school. What are some good steps to take? What type of officer is sought after to become a Whiskey? How should you prepare for it?

I'm an ABM headed down to Tyndall in September, so I'd also like to know what pilots want from ABMs at Nellis, and what we should look to pilots for during the class.

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.