When you are truly not guilty of a speeding charge?

[HerkDerka]

I agree with everything accept "admitting your mistake".

If you answer "Yes officer, I know why you just pulled me over. I was speeding." You just cut your legs out from underneath you and you have a recorded admission of guilt. Try taking that one to court.

Everything else is money though.

HD

[Guest Robes]

Right on HD! If you say you did not know how fast you were going, you can bet that is going to show up on the ticket. So then you go to court and you are asked, or tell the DA, I was going 35 mph in a 35 mph zone and the DA says BS, you told the Ofc that you did not know how fast you were going. Watch what you say to a cop, we tend to remember things.

[HerkDerka]

And you tend to have the lapel microphones that work with the dash camera too!

I've been pulled over at least six times in the last few years and didn't receive a ticket.

HD's technique.

-Pull over and turn off the engine

-Turn on interior lights if it's night time.

-Keep hands visible and don't start reaching in the glove box.

-Produced paperwork when asked

-Include military ID with license.

-Be polite, but don't kiss his butt

-Watch what you say

My standard answer to "Do you know why I pulled you over?" or "Do you know how fast you were going" is "I believe I was going a safe speed." It gives the prosecutor nothing (from your end) and isn't a jerk thing to say.

And don't be a butthole unless the situation is COMPLETELY LUDICROUS. If you get the ticket then realize it was YOUR choice to speed, not the cop's. He's doing his job.

I've noticed that cops notice things like turning off the engine and not reaching in the glove box. They don't know if you're some 15 year old punk with a gun under the seat. Cops appreciate a little wingman consideration.

Your thoughts Robes?

HD

[Gravedigger]

Good tips HD. In addition, I render a verbal greeting including Sir/Ma'am. It shows respect for their authoritah. 3 of my last 4 stops have ended ticket free. The other was really reduced, so I count it as 4 wins.

[Guest sleepy]

Honesty all the way. A few years back I was pulled over at 2 a.m. New Years Day morning. After a polite greeting between the two of us, the deputy asked, "Do you know why I pulled you over?" I was doing nothing wrong (seriously), so I said, "No sir." He accused me of weaving, which was complete BS, but hey, it was New Year's Eve/Morning and I'm the only one on the road. He and I both knew why I was tagged. As bogus as it was, I'm glad he pulled me over.

He then asked me if I had been drinking. "Yes sir, I have." Although it had been three hours since, I couldn't lie...I mean, it's New Year's Eve, and I have a few unopened Diet Millers in the passenger seat. He didn't think it was funny when I offered him one. I of course, exited the vehicle, ten fingers on the roof, got the pat down, oh what's this? "It's a pocket knife and a cell phone." I then produced my concealed weapon permit--cell phones are lethal, you know. After that, it was walk the line, touch my nose, blow into the box...nothing but zeros. At this point another car passed. "I've got no business with you," said he as he darted off.

Thank God for that passing car. I had to pee like a racehorse...I was able to go right there and avoid a public indecency charge.

[M2]

HD

Same techniques I used the weekend before last when I got pulled on the motorcycle. Another good tip is to ensure you and the cop are safely off the road when you pull over. I pointed to a parking lot just up the road from where we were, the DPS officer driving nodded it was OK to move to that location.

I still was cited (I thought I should only have gotten a warning, but it isn't uncommon for bike to race around the Texas Hill Country), but if you look at the pic in my profile, you will see that I look like I am speeding even when I am not!

By the way, I was speeding, and I was told I was doing 84 in a 70 (I never said anything and was wondering how fast they clocked me). I may have been going that fast, or even faster; but I find it more important to keep my eyes on the road and not my speedo!

The funniest part of it all was that my license plate had fallen off earlier in the day (the dealership that put it on didn't do a good job, and I hadn't noticed it had come off!), and the DPS officers never said a thing about it! I don't know if that was part of the reason I got a ticket instead of a warning (think about it, I had no tag); but you would have thought they would have said something! I didn't notice it until I got home and parked the bike in the garage...

I am taking a defensive driving course on-line to negate the ticket, so all is well and good. Still costing me $141 for court costs and the course fee, but that beats getting points on my license!

Cheers! M2

[Guest Robes]

There are a couple of other things I would add:

When you see the lights behind you, do not just stop where you are! Keep going and find a safe place to pull over. With that do not make any quick movements with the car. (use your turn signal, I have some fellow Ofcs who tack that on too. Cheap)

When you pull over, if at all possible, stop under a street light or in a well lit area (officer safety).

Tinted windows are a pain, if a person cannot see inside crack the window a bit so the Ofc can make sure there is no one with a gun in the back seat.

If you are going to reach for your license or registration, tell the Ofc where it is before you reach for it.

Most times if the Ofc does not tell you how fast you were going on first contact you will be getting a warning. DO NOT ask how fast you were going many cops will change their mind, tell you how fast and then write the ticket.

DO NOT CRY! I have given the ticket just because of the crying!

You will not get out of a DWI, the ticket!

As for the military ID... I know if someone whips out their military ID just to show me they are in the military pisses me off. I am in the military, that does not give me the right to speed, but being a cop does. :D

I would suggest placing the military ID in with the license. I have part of a wallet (flip portion where the license goes on a bi-fold wallet) where I keep my commission and on the other half my license. Police notice things like a military ID in the wallet or the DOD decal, but many take offense when military people just whip out the ID.

If I pull you over you probably will not get the ticket (have not issued one to anyone in my unit).

Most of all just be polite and up front, understanding that the police are just doing their job. If you have any questions let me know and I will answer them. There are a few of rules of being a peace officer: 1. everyone goes home safe at the end of the shift 2. Do not wreck your cruiser 3. Violation of rule number 2 may result in violation of rule number 1.

Robes

[ 12. October 2005, 19:13: Message edited by: Robes ]

[war007afa]

Originally posted by MajorMadMax:

HD

... but that beats getting points on my license!

Cheers! M2

Many Texas juresdictions will not report tickets as a part has to go to the state if they do, whereas if they don't the proceeds stay with the county (so I've been told, and that really doesn't make too much sense to me, either, but that's how it is -->reference the town of Dumas, TX). Also, in Texas it requires 3 tickets or more (unless they are of the "arrestable" nature) to increase your rates. But those go away after 3 years. But at any rate, why risk it?

[Guest Rainman A-10]

Originally posted by Robes:

As for the military ID... I know if someone whips out their military ID just to show me they are in the military pisses me off. I am in the military, that does not give me the right to speed, but being a cop does.

Wow, interesting. I would think there would be some professional respect. I know I would have some. In fact, I would think I could talk man to man with another military member. Whatever.

I had a state trooper who lived in my neighborhood. He was always tearing ass though the neighborhood in his cruiser. I stopped him one day and asked him to slow it down. He used the bullshit "I can speed, I'm a cop" line. I told him I thought that was the dumbest thing I had ever heard but if he really needed to haul ass thought the neighborhood he needed to turn on his lights and siren so the 69 kids he whips by know to stay out of the way. He said I didn't know what I was talking about or who I was talking to.

Three days later, my boys shacked his trooper car with their water balloon launcher as he was going around a corner on two wheels past our house (on the way home from work, I might add). I was working in the back yard and did my best not to laugh out loud. The guy stopped, got out, walked toward the house and I met him in the front yard. I was willing to make my boys stand up to the man but he was cool about it. The guy is also an assistant football coach at the high school and he started laughing about it. He thought my boys were the shit because they are always in the back yard with a ball of some sort and a bunch of other kids knocking the crap out of each other. We shook hands, never mentioning our previous conversation. He drove by in his pickup a couple minutes later, taunting the boys with his window down. They put a water ballon right into his truck which exploded against the passnger side window and soaked the guy. I laughed my ass off and so did he.

He never sped thought the neighborhood again, which was cool.

[Hacker]

I was given a ticket in Tex-ass back when I was in tech school at Sheppard when I was a Lieutenant.

Like many of you, I offered my military ID along with my driver's license -- my reasoning was a little different, though, because my Washington State license was a military license, with an expiration date of "90 days after discharge." I was offering my mil ID as proof that I was in the military.

The officer didn't see it that way, and gave me some lip about did I think I was going to get off easy just because I was flashing my military ID??

When he gave me the ticket, the Tejas DPS guy said "Here's your ID back LIEUTENANT" in the snottiest tone I've ever heard from the po-lice.

Maybe I should get one of those black stickers with the blue stripe...the "free pass to speed" sticker. <not>

[M2]

I include my military ID to explain why I have a Florida license and tag (well, if there was a tag on the bike), but a Texas insurance card. Yes, it has the secondary effect of showing I am also a public servant and professional, and I do expect to be treated with more respect than some yahoo 18-year-old unemployed punk, I think that 20+ years in uniform has earned me that much.

I was almost going to argue the safety issue when I got pulled over a week ago…for one, I was wearing full leathers and a helmet in a state where half of the motorcyclists ride around with just a bandana on their head. Secondly, I have had risk assessment and management hammered into my head for my entire career, I know how to balance it. Three, I have been riding motorcycles for over 30 years, and have had one pretty much my entire adult life. I have completed several MSF and AF safety courses. Fourthly, I have a brand new litre-class sportbike, engineered to operate at higher speeds a lot safer than the 30-yr-old rusting F150 with retread tires I passed ten minutes earlier. Last, I am 42, married with two kids, I am not out to kill myself. I may be having fun on the edge of the spectrum, but I am not suicidal and I know the difference.

But, I passed as I didn’t think it would help my cause. The odd thing is yesterday afternoon I was at the local police station getting some unrelated paperwork taken care of, and I had a hour-long discussion with an officer on sportbikes. He was telling me the safest places to speed, and where not to, and pretty much admitted that he was a wheelie fanatic and had owned several sportbikes in the past. It just goes to show you that cops are people just like us, and just like us you will have your heroes and assholes. Hopefully you will encounter more of the former, and less of the latter!

Cheers! M2

p.s. war007afa, thanks for the info, I don't know if it is true or not (I hope so), and as it was actually cheaper to go the defensive driving course route, I thought it was the wiser move.

[Guest TheBurt]

Urban myths about speeding. One, The officer is required to show you the speed, wrong. Two, If the officer is not there the day you come to court it will be dismissed, mostly wrong (and I'm sure some of you have had them dismissed this way, but it is not a given)

Troopers are well versed in how radar works and how to defend a radar case in court. Radar is corroborating evidence as to the speed of the vehicle, it is NOT probable cause for the citation, the officers 'opinion' is the probable cause for the arrest (a speeding citation is an 'arrest') Stationary and moving radar are always in favor of the violator (radar is measuring the hypotenuse of the triangle, as the vehicle gets closer, the speed on the radar actually decreases)

In NC, radar and VASCAR Troopers are required to requalify every couple of years. This is not an easy ordeal. You must be able to visually estimate the speed of 10 vehicles within 5 mph, 5 stationary clocks and 5 moving clocks, you are graded against the radar, any miss outside this tolerance is a disqualification. You are removed from the radar program and given a month or two to come back and try again. This testing is what qualifies the officers 'opinion', and that is what an attorney has to defeat, not the radar itself. Yes, he can try to go after the officer not having the proper documentation ie. every 6 months a radar calibration by a qualified radio technician, or the officers certification or the Trooper not using his tuning forks.....but guess what...........the bad news is........we always kept a copy of these documents in our little black briefcases when we came to court, and attorneys know that, the would only try it if you were paying the big bucks and you would still lose. I never had to defend a speeding case, attorneys aren't going to go after it for the 300-1000 dollars that you blindly pay them, you are paying him to use his influence with the assistant DA and the Trooper behind closed doors when they are smokin and jokin during the morning recess while you are sitting in court waiting for the judge to come back, you are paying to have your case reduced...............so with that said...... my advice on speeding tickets: STFU...... be polite, remember, you may be getting a verbal or written warning, he may be going to eat with his buddies, he may be going to have sex with some waitress, he may be in a good mood and just wants to show the Sarge that he actually does stop cars every now and then. Trust me, speeding tickets are just as much a pain in the ass to them as it is to you.. why you ask? Well it's kind of like a nagging wife, most of the time you'd rather stay at work than to listen to her shit right? Same way with the Trooper, speeders aren't hardened criminals, they are just..well...speeding, it's not very exciting giving a usually law abiding citizen a citation and the citizen doesn't like it. The citizen then begins to rationalize, 'I was going 52 not 84' and then convinces himself through a process called denial....and then begins to take mental notes about everything you say and then begins to twist those words and actions into his advantage (sound like your wife?), and alas, decides to call the Sarge and make a complaint.

Bottom line: YOU can ALWAYS talk yourself OUT of a warning ticket.

[Guest sleepy]

Originally posted by TheBurt:

Trust me, speeding tickets are just as much a pain in the ass to them as it is to you..

If it's such a pain in the ass, why did this happen to me this morning?

Going out of town where I live the speed limit rapidly increases from 35 to 45 then 55. I got stopped for doing 51 in a 35. I'll give her the 51 part, but not in the 35 zone. I digress. I did all the right things and was very polite. These words were all I got from her: "License and proof of insurance." I gave them to her. Then, "I clocked you doing 51 in a 35. Would you like me to check the calibration on the laser?" I told her not to worry about it, because I figured she was close and I didn't want it to take any longer than necessary.

Waddle back to the cruiser.

After returning from the cruiser, I got a "This is your court date, sign here. Have a safe day." That's it. But here's what really pisses me off. My battery died while I was waiting for her to complete the paperwork! I laughed, asked her for a jump. For some reason, she couldn't do it. She split, only to come zooming by again three minutes later with blue lights flashing while I am trying to locate some assistance.

No "good morning," "why are you in a hurry," no nothing from her, and she left me hanging so she could go nab someone else. My hairy ass it's a pain in her/their ass!

I'm still in the wrong.

[Gravedigger]

Sleepy, that is some serious horse-shit. Sounds like some of the Atlanta cops I have dealt with.

Originally posted by TheBurt:

Trust me, speeding tickets are just as much a pain in the ass to them as it is to you

Writing tickets doesn't cost cops hundreds of dollars, raise their insurance, or make them late for work, so I cant see how it is a pain in the ass for them. If it was, they wouldn't write a couple hundred tickets a month per person. Also, every officer knows that more tickets=more money.

[ 13. October 2005, 22:39: Message edited by: c17wannabe ]

[Guest shawty]

Not here to start an argument, I am just a big fan of facts. In Colorado (specifically) the officer does not and most likely will not show you anything that you ask him for regarding proof. Of course there will be cases where they do and things are thrown out but as far as law goes, it varies in every state.

Just my 2 cents.

My advice would be call the DA and discuss it with them. Have a local police department do a radar speed check where you set up a time to go drive past a patrol car several times at set indicated speeds and they record actual. Then bring those (or fax) those results from the police station to the problem police station. Looks more official.

Good luck

[ 14. October 2005, 00:41: Message edited by: shawty ]

[Guest TheBurt]

C17,

A Trooper doesn't write 'a couple hundred tickets a month', I averaged 15-20 total charges per week (only 3-5 speeding charges), speed enforcement was basically at the bottom of the list. When I wrote a speeding ticket it was a 'clear cut and substantial violation', meaning speed and the conditions warranted the citation. We didn't have time to write dozens of speeding tickets, speed enforcement was usually getting a high speeder while going to a non-emergency call, with the amount of accidents in my district there wasn't a lot of time for speeding tickets, and in my experience in the Patrol my fellow Troopers in other districts had similar numbers, Day shift was wrecks and night shift was DWI hunting, drug enforcement and wrecks, now speeding was a great way to pull you over to get a smell and look at you, but unless it was high speed they were almost always warning tickets, it was a matter of making as many contacts as possible to get drunk drivers and drug arrests. Um, 'every officer knows more tickets=more money', to much TV or belief in urban legends?

Shawty

Good luck in calling the DA about a speeding case, they usually have bigger fish to fry. The talk with the Assistant DA or ADA is usually made the morning before the court sessions starts, unless your dad is best friends with the DA they usually tell you to talk to the ADA when you get to court, which is a nice way of them saying **** off.

'Problem police station'??? WTFO

TheBurt formerly Trooper Burt

[Gravedigger]

Burt, those numbers came directly from the mouth of the cop that briefed us in LLab the other day. He is part of the DUI task-force, and he mentioned that technique you did. Pull someone over, take a good whiff, if he's smells something then he continues, if not it's just a warning. He said that as part of the DUI task force, he stll issues around 50-60 speeding tickets and about 20 DUIs a month. Granted this is Atlanta, so we probably have higher than average numbers, but he acted like 150 tickets was nothing for normal cops. He did say that taking speeders to jail was a big pain, so most cops just reduce it, but if the person is an ass, it's worth it. As for the money thing, does your precinct not collect money from tickets? The cops I know around here seem to like the new gadgets they get when they have good months.

[Guest TheBurt]

C17,

I thought you said a couple hundred tickets per person, and like I said, I wrote 15-20 charges per week which is around 60-80 charges per month. No, the ticket money does not go to the precinct or district, in NC the fines went to the NC Dept of Education and the court fee's (the largest part of the ticket expense) went to the .....court.

Yes, I know a few guys that would try and write 50-80 tickets per week, you cannot sustain that pace for very long

[Guest markkyle66]

Just curious who has he been caught going the fastest out of you guys. My ticket was for doing 115 in a 65 on a old backroad out in the country with my SS. A state trooper camaro ambushed me : [ right when i was slowing down too : ]