Questions on Aerobatics

[Flare]

At least in tweets, we teach you the numbers, but to gain proficiency, you have to be able to "hands" the maneuver. In the case of the loop, the most important thing is a constant, consistent nose track.

[Guest Hoser]

Flying the jet by feel is introduced to the students during the Transiion Phase and again on their AHC ride. It becomes very important when you are flying DBFM, and you are looking over your shoulder, not staring thru your HUD.

Lose Sight, Lose Fight.

2: "Blind", 1: "Continue" 2: "Sh1t" 1: "Track!"

Hoser

[Ram]

Originally posted by Bender:

On top of that...an training jet over-G is an training jet over-G, what's the diff?

I see the burner comment with yours, making it a clearly unacceptable over-G, but...what's the diff?

My example was a flight discipline deal. Burner loops aren't exactly authorized maneuvers for solo studs. That's why the flight got a visit from the DO. Good times, right?

His example sounded more like gross mishandling of the aircraft. "Rolling inverted and pulling" doesn't sound like a stud that's trying to do something "cool" he heard from his buddies...instead it sounds like the dude just screwed up.

I think there's a huge difference between the two. But what do I know? I'm just a swaggering FAIP.

Ha.

[Zippy]

Originally posted by g2s:

Okay, so my Turbomentor doesn't pull a lot of G's... We do a hole 3.5 on our plane. Yee-haw, great balls of fire! Thanks.

Come on man, you can take the trim whore to 4.5 no problem- stop selling yourself short.

[Wing Sweep]

True, true Zip. I'll compromise with you and bump it up to 4!

[Whitman]

Anyone have experience with single seat Pitts Special, the experimental type? I was surprised at the low cost (mid 20's) for these airplanes and they seem very capable. I'm looking at a couple with the I/O 320 (160hp). Basically looking for something fun to fly after work (when not deployed) and IFR and XC are not too much of a consideration. Barnstormers has several for sale.

[moosepileit]

Owned a 180 HP S1S for 12 years and 500 hours. 160hp is ok if you are FAA std 5-10 and 170# w/ your 15# chute on.

1/2 the value is the engine/prop, the other 1/2 is the airframe.

Lyc's only go about 10 years before you have to worry about camshaft rot (sits above the crank in the air and rusts).

I suggest a 5 yr since OH and about 300 hours since overhaul- that way you know if the motor's any good and should still show no wear- PM if you want details in pain- lucky for me, other's pain- I had a great motor.

Empty weight is the next value- 800# or less is optimal, light is good.

There are 2 fuselage lengths- the S1C or basic short fuselage- limit to also Std FAA sizes.

The "long" or real S1S cockpit is longer- I am 6'1 and 230 in a chute and was ok w/ 3/4 tank of gas for acro w&b envelope.

The type of prop and battery location are the biggest impacts you can change to W&B.

Prop- fixed pitch is fine- you should get 125kt cruise at 2350 rpm w/ 76x60 prop if 180HP and a 1700' vertical line from a 180 MPH 2700 rpm 4 g pull.

Round wings and 4 ailerons- need a little push inverted vs upright, but less than anything else under $100k. You can trim it out, but most trim for nuetral pitch at 170-180 mph so you know when to pull after downlines.

Spins- inverted is safer than upright- recovers quicker- get plenty of training- you won't like it at first, but a hammerspin can kill you, as will the crossover from upright to inverted. Bill Finagin on the East Coast by Annapolis is fine, again, PM for others or get on the IAC acro news list exploder.

Roll rate- 240 deg/sec, better when snapping- you'll be the limiting factor for the first few hundred hours if you want gradeable quality.

Paint- polyurethanes are hard to repair and when they start to crack and craze there is little you can do.

The tailwheel part- well- I enjoyed the heck out of it- learned on 35' wide blacktop in an S2A, but started years back in gliders- stick, rudder, rudder, rudder.. Solo in an S1 is more fun than the S2s- they are all like trucks compared to the S1, though they may be really big 260+hp trucks. Front seat in an S2A or B is good training, but you really wear the S1s. Back seat S2 flying is not a great S1 simulator, but S2Bs and Cs do rock in their own way.

Feel free to PM.

[Whitman]

Feel free to PM.

Pm is on its way! You obviously know your stuff.

[ellsworb]

I had fun in my limited (<100 hrs) in an S1C. Did a pretty nice job through intermediate (if you're looking at competitions). I knew of one guy that flew advanced (poorly) and was always having issues with his up-lines. And i don't think you can find a cheaper airplane to own and operate.

How big are you? I'm 6'2" and that SOB was tight.

I will always pour one for Curtis Pitts though. The Model 12 is on my very short list.