Track Selects and Assignment Nights

[HossHarris]

As I stated several pages ago, like it or not, the af makes a quality cut at track select. There are plenty of exceptions .... 

[Lord Ratner]

As I stated several pages ago, like it or not, the af makes a quality cut at track select. There are plenty of exceptions .... 

A better way to phrase it (back in 2013 at least, though I can't imagine it's gotten better), is that the AF wants to make a quality cut. When I turned down a T-38 (2009), it was only one of three for my class, and the next guy was still in the top third of the class. With classes having 5 or 6 -38s, and even more people choosing T-1s for lifestyle/career/whatever reasons, sometimes people got -38s that the resident fighter pilots didn't believe were of the correct caliber.

But they went anyways, because, as the RTUs are facing (I hear), the AF is going to get it's numbers, and the denominator, in this case training, can always be changed to normalize the results.

[Kenny Powers]

When I turned down a T-38

Was it due to the fear of getting ATIS by yourself?

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[Sprkt69]

1 hour ago, gearpig said:

Ok. I don't know what aircraft you fly or what mission you do. I suppose there could be training benefits in refusing to take the aircraft and task saturating a guy with copying ATIS, in the clear, at home station, at 16,000', with the autopilot on.

It just appeared as if, by creating a post to mock your copilots, you were confusing your their earlier training for adherence to basic CRM with an inability to multi-task. 

If your expectation is that the copilot will become task saturated copying down ATIS while on autopilot in clear and a million, then that copilot just needs to turn in their wings. If you can't push the boundaries of ability in a safe manner, what are your expectations when things start going very wrong?

[di1630]

I sat jumpseat in a C-17 hopping from Bagram to Manas. I got a kick out of watching the crew work after only flying single seat for 500 hours.

I noticed while everyone was sharing tasks running checklists we were really high cruising fast getting close to the field.

The approach was a sh-tshow start to finish flown by the co-pilot who was a fresh LT. At the end we were too high to land so they had to go missed, and the LT in frustration told the IP, "you have the jet"....I was happy to see the IP tell him to take the jet and fly the missed.

I knew right then how different our worlds were.



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[Lord Ratner]

Was it due to the fear of getting ATIS by yourself?
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You edited your comment to improve your insult?

[Kenny Powers]

You edited your comment to improve your insult?

Yes. It's a joke Nancy.

My drunken fingers hit enter before I finished typing the first time.

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[Mark1]

14 hours ago, di1630 said:

I sat jumpseat in a C-17 hopping from Bagram to Manas. I got a kick out of watching the crew work after only flying single seat for 500 hours.

I noticed while everyone was sharing tasks running checklists we were really high cruising fast getting close to the field.

The approach was a sh-tshow start to finish flown by the co-pilot who was a fresh LT. At the end we were too high to land so they had to go missed, and the LT in frustration told the IP, "you have the jet"....I was happy to see the IP tell him to take the jet and fly the missed.

I knew right then how different our worlds were.

One night North of JBAD we were supporting a routine nightly DA from the bottom of an air stack 20 miles high.  Upon infil the objective village came to life and a large group with small arms, RPGs, and recoilless rifles headed for the high ground surrounding the objective.  We kept track of their movement with 25% of the capacity of one of our two sensors while supporting other tasks with the rest.

When the F-16 flight finally finished yo-yo ops and got both birds back onstation from JOKERing out prior to infil due to a 15min slip in the timeline, we talked them on.  The group stopped and set up a fighting position in the terrain above the objective leading the GFC to decide to engage prior to entering the objective village.  Friendlies were still several clicks away and the targets were in the middle of nowhere.  As a result, and because it wasn't a critical or time sensitive engagement, the JTAC decided to throw a bone to the F-16s.  A way to get them in the game as thanks for showing up night after night and watching in the background while we took care of the meaningful engagements.

In the process of 9-line coordination, the F-16s lost sight of the targets (which hadn't moved) and were unable to reacquire.  We moved out, found them, and talked the F-16s back on.  We then attempted to confirm basic fighter/gunship integration procedures to allow us to remain overhead at the time of strike, but it caused confusion on their part and the JTAC opted to push us off rather than spend the time to unfuck it.  The initial drop incapacitated 2 or 3 of about 15 and the re-attack turned into a shitshow that never left home plate after the F-16s lost tally again.  After giving the targets a 5min headstart to run in a bomburst pattern off the original impact site the JTAC got fed up, aborted the re-attack, and called us back overhead.

Despite having been in BFE for the initial strike, the first round left the aircraft ~3 seconds after arriving overhead without aid of the assets that were supposed to have custody of the target.  The remaining 12 or 13 spread all over the mountainside were cleaned up in 1/5 the time that it took for 9-line coordination on the initial strike, while the F-16s faded back into the background.

I knew right then how different our worlds were.

[di1630]

One night North of JBAD we were supporting a routine nightly DA from the bottom of an air stack 20 miles high.  Upon infil the objective village came to life and a large group with small arms, RPGs, and recoilless rifles headed for the high ground surrounding the objective.  We kept track of their movement with 25% of the capacity of one of our two sensors while supporting other tasks with the rest.

When the F-16 flight finally finished yo-yo ops and got both birds back onstation from JOKERing out prior to infil due to a 15min slip in the timeline, we talked them on.  The group stopped and set up a fighting position in the terrain above the objective leading the GFC to decide to engage prior to entering the objective village.  Friendlies were still several clicks away and the targets were in the middle of nowhere.  As a result, and because it wasn't a critical or time sensitive engagement, the JTAC decided to throw a bone to the F-16s.  A way to get them in the game as thanks for showing up night after night and watching in the background while we took care of the meaningful engagements.
In the process of 9-line coordination, the F-16s lost sight of the targets (which hadn't moved) and were unable to reacquire.  We moved out, found them, and talked the F-16s back on.  We then attempted to confirm basic fighter/gunship integration procedures to allow us to remain overhead at the time of strike, but it caused confusion on their part and the JTAC opted to push us off rather than spend the time to un it.  The initial drop incapacitated 2 or 3 of about 15 and the re-attack turned into a shitshow that never left home plate after the F-16s lost tally again.  After giving the targets a 5min headstart to run in a bomburst pattern off the original impact site the JTAC got fed up, aborted the re-attack, and called us back overhead.
Despite having been in BFE for the initial strike, the first round left the aircraft ~3 seconds after arriving overhead without aid of the assets that were supposed to have custody of the target.  The remaining 12 or 13 spread all over the mountainside were cleaned up in 1/5 the time that it took for 9-line coordination on the initial strike, while the F-16s faded back into the background.
I knew right then how different our worlds were.

The F-16 exceeded my expectations in that story.




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[Champ Kind]

One night North of JBAD we were supporting a routine nightly DA from the bottom of an air stack 20 miles high.  Upon infil the objective village came to life and a large group with small arms, RPGs, and recoilless rifles headed for the high ground surrounding the objective.  We kept track of their movement with 25% of the capacity of one of our two sensors while supporting other tasks with the rest.

When the F-16 flight finally finished yo-yo ops and got both birds back onstation from JOKERing out prior to infil due to a 15min slip in the timeline, we talked them on.  The group stopped and set up a fighting position in the terrain above the objective leading the GFC to decide to engage prior to entering the objective village.  Friendlies were still several clicks away and the targets were in the middle of nowhere.  As a result, and because it wasn't a critical or time sensitive engagement, the JTAC decided to throw a bone to the F-16s.  A way to get them in the game as thanks for showing up night after night and watching in the background while we took care of the meaningful engagements.
In the process of 9-line coordination, the F-16s lost sight of the targets (which hadn't moved) and were unable to reacquire.  We moved out, found them, and talked the F-16s back on.  We then attempted to confirm basic fighter/gunship integration procedures to allow us to remain overhead at the time of strike, but it caused confusion on their part and the JTAC opted to push us off rather than spend the time to un it.  The initial drop incapacitated 2 or 3 of about 15 and the re-attack turned into a shitshow that never left home plate after the F-16s lost tally again.  After giving the targets a 5min headstart to run in a bomburst pattern off the original impact site the JTAC got fed up, aborted the re-attack, and called us back overhead.
Despite having been in BFE for the initial strike, the first round left the aircraft ~3 seconds after arriving overhead without aid of the assets that were supposed to have custody of the target.  The remaining 12 or 13 spread all over the mountainside were cleaned up in 1/5 the time that it took for 9-line coordination on the initial strike, while the F-16s faded back into the background.
I knew right then how different our worlds were.

So who got ATIS on your RTB?

[Lord Ratner]

So who got ATIS on your RTB?

The boom in the nearest tanker

[matmacwc]

12 hours ago, di1630 said:

The F-16 exceeded my expectations in that story.




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Phuk you.

[ATIS]

14 hours ago, Mark1 said:

One night North of JBAD we were supporting a routine nightly DA from the bottom of an air stack 20 miles high.  Upon infil the objective village came to life and a large group with small arms, RPGs, and recoilless rifles headed for the high ground surrounding the objective.  We kept track of their movement with 25% of the capacity of one of our two sensors while supporting other tasks with the rest.

When the F-16 flight finally finished yo-yo ops and got both birds back onstation from JOKERing out prior to infil due to a 15min slip in the timeline, we talked them on.  The group stopped and set up a fighting position in the terrain above the objective leading the GFC to decide to engage prior to entering the objective village.  Friendlies were still several clicks away and the targets were in the middle of nowhere.  As a result, and because it wasn't a critical or time sensitive engagement, the JTAC decided to throw a bone to the F-16s.  A way to get them in the game as thanks for showing up night after night and watching in the background while we took care of the meaningful engagements.

In the process of 9-line coordination, the F-16s lost sight of the targets (which hadn't moved) and were unable to reacquire.  We moved out, found them, and talked the F-16s back on.  We then attempted to confirm basic fighter/gunship integration procedures to allow us to remain overhead at the time of strike, but it caused confusion on their part and the JTAC opted to push us off rather than spend the time to un it.  The initial drop incapacitated 2 or 3 of about 15 and the re-attack turned into a shitshow that never left home plate after the F-16s lost tally again.  After giving the targets a 5min headstart to run in a bomburst pattern off the original impact site the JTAC got fed up, aborted the re-attack, and called us back overhead.

Despite having been in BFE for the initial strike, the first round left the aircraft ~3 seconds after arriving overhead without aid of the assets that were supposed to have custody of the target.  The remaining 12 or 13 spread all over the mountainside were cleaned up in 1/5 the time that it took for 9-line coordination on the initial strike, while the F-16s faded back into the background.

I knew right then how different our worlds were.

So there I was.....

Of course our worlds are/were different.  Even inside that world, stack players were different.  I've got hundreds of stories of every T/M/S that fly in the stack

Call "Clara" on the ball and lets avoid a flaming dialog on F-16/CAS/DA support.?

ATIS 

 

[BashiChuni]

13 hours ago, Champ Kind said:

 

So who got ATIS on your RTB?

i almost spit my beer out when i read this well played!

[SDA1989]

this thread has become the most hilarious gathering of turds in the military aviation community. 

[BFM this]

Meh, gotta entertain ourselves between track/assignment nights.

[WishfulPlinking]

Cool so CBM 17-14 track.

2 active 38s

1 guard 38

2 international 38s

15 T-1

1 reserve Helo

1 active helo  (wanted it)

 

As far as active 38s, there was only going to be 1, but they cut a deal yesterday to wash back a complete international and get a second slot for AD.

Pretty much.....yeah... there were some good sticks who didn't get their first choice. 

And I got T-1s, although I think if it was a couple classes back I'd be in 38s, and I'm happy to take it because honestly I am just glad to be here and fly.  

Just remember for the up and coming hot-as-shit SNAPs, a lot of guys have come before you, and you are entitled to nothing.  Don't be a b*tch and take your track with some dignity.  

[LookieRookie]

T-38 numbers for CBM makes sense since they are barely treading water with their student requirements.

[RTB]

15 minutes ago, WishfulPlinking said:

Cool so CBM 17-14 track.

2 active 38s

1 guard 38

2 international 38s

15 T-1

1 reserve Helo

1 active helo  (wanted it)

 

As far as active 38s, there was only going to be 1, but they cut a deal yesterday to wash back a complete international and get a second slot for AD.

Pretty much.....yeah... there were some good sticks who didn't get their first choice. 

And I got T-1s, although I think if it was a couple classes back I'd be in 38s, and I'm happy to take it because honestly I am just glad to be here and fly.  

Just remember for the up and coming hot-as-shit SNAPs, a lot of guys have come before you, and you are entitled to nothing.  Don't be a b*tch and take your track with some dignity.  

5 38s and 15 T-1s?  Is that the normal distribution these days??

[HossHarris]

Fighter pilot shortage .... 15 years behind and the pipeline is working half days to catch up

[Inertia17]

DLF 17-14 Track

2 International T-38s

6 AD T-38s (3 washed forward from 17-15)

1 AD Helo

14 T-1 (1 wash forward)

 

There were also 3 from 17-14 who washed into 17-13 (2 T-38/1 T-1).

[ViperStud]

8 hours ago, WishfulPlinking said:

Don't be a b*tch and take your track with some dignity.  

Story?

[tk1313]

11 hours ago, HossHarris said:

Fighter pilot shortage .... 15 years behind and the pipeline is working half days to catch up

Government problem solving.

[dream big]

17 hours ago, WishfulPlinking said:

Cool so CBM 17-14 track.

2 active 38s

1 guard 38

2 international 38s

15 T-1

1 reserve Helo

1 active helo  (wanted it)

 

As far as active 38s, there was only going to be 1, but they cut a deal yesterday to wash back a complete international and get a second slot for AD.

Pretty much.....yeah... there were some good sticks who didn't get their first choice. 

And I got T-1s, although I think if it was a couple classes back I'd be in 38s, and I'm happy to take it because honestly I am just glad to be here and fly.  

Just remember for the up and coming hot-as-shit SNAPs, a lot of guys have come before you, and you are entitled to nothing.  Don't be a b*tch and take your track with some dignity.  

Great attitude.  Not sure why specifically you wanted T-38s but part of the reason many want it is to put bombs on the bad guys.   There are a few opportunities to do that in the T-1 track (gunships, AFSOC in general.) Best of luck to you 

[YoungnDumb]

END 17-14 Track

8 AD T-38's

2 INTL T-38's

1 Helo

10 T-1's