Weight/body fat issues (under/over)

[Guest EZ206PILOT]

This is just a general question regarding the physical. Do you automatically bust your physical if you a couple pounds over the max weight? Any help would be appreciated.

[Guest OldGuy]

No, doesn't automatically bust it. If you're overweight, the next step is a body fat test. If you do ok there, you should be good.

One cautionary note, though. My brother flies f-15C's and currently is an IP in t-38's. If I remember right, there was something about the ejection seat where he had to meet a certain weight. He was over, and even though he tested out ok on body fat, he still had to drop the pounds or get grounded.

[Guest pilot2B]

I believe the body fat % is at 21% for males.

[Guest EZ206PILOT]

What would happen to someone who is 2 pounds overweight and 23% body fat. Would that automatically disqualify you.

[C17Driver]

From what I have seen and heard, being overweight and over body fat ususally requires you to get medically evaluated.

One thing that will happen... If you are at your UPT base and getting ready to start, if you are overweight (over body fat), they will not allow you to start. If you are in academics and then go overweight (over body fat) they will not allow you to hit the flight line.. at least not initially. They will usually wash you back.

(Disclaimer, if you are overweight, but under body fat then no problem)

This is based on what I saw at Vance last year.

[Scooter14]

The Vance policy still stands. If you know you are gonna be going into the AF, get your butt out there and start PTing.

I'm one of those "always on the edge" kind of guys, and if I slack on the PT, I pack on the fat. I usually manage to avoid the tape, but I think the Body Fat is based on age. I wanna say it was like 20%, but goes up to 24% when you hit 30. The AF is always changing, looking at Body Mass Index, etc, etc. I've found the best way to avoid hassle is to be underweight.

BTW, the new Air Force fitness test is on the way. Push ups and sit ups and a 1.5 mile run. Also, the AF has this fun little test called the FACT (Fighter Air Crew) test. EVERYONE has to take it at UPT, even ANG/AFRES guys going to fly heavies. Navs, if you go Strike at P-Cola, gotta do it there too. If you fail it, it's not a big deal, just that your classmates all get to see how little you can lift...

[Guest eyetrouble]

In the last few years the AF and even the Guard/Res have been big on the weight program. Right now I have had to drop weight, even though I was under fat, they wanted me underweight. At 6'2 I am only allowed to weigh 211 or less. I am 225, so I have been dieting and PTing pretty hard. The closer I am to the AF ideal weight the better I am. If you can stay within the range that will be better.

The AF body fat test is bogus, because it averages out to be neck-waist= your body fat. The new AF PT test is also bogus. If you are an Anorexic that can run 1.5 miles in under 9:34, 57 push-ups, 57 sit-ups, and not to mention a waist that is under 32" then you will earn your 100 points.

Remember, fit to fight is the new motto

[Toro]

The Air Force is changing their fitness standards. The bike test (an absolute joke) is gone, replaced by a less-of-a-joke test that has you doing timed push ups, sit ups, a 1.5 mile run, and having your waist measured. Along with this, they've done away with the 'Fat Boy Program' which gave everybody a Max Allowable Weight based off your height. If you were over your MAW, you'd be put on the Fat Boy program (I think it was called weight monitoring or something) were they basically would continue to monitor you for a couple months, then tell you again that you were too fat. I guess the idea now is that if you can pass the fitness test, it doesn't matter what your weight is. Personally, I think using weight as a measure of fitness is ridiculous. I could be 6'2" and 230 pounds of pure muscle and in outstanding shape, but the AF would say I was overweighed. Or I could be a rail thin dude at 160 and they'd think I was in great shape. Good they dropped it.

[Guest Lightninbo]

toro... where did you hear this and when is it implemented..... was told a couple months ago that I was over weight at 215 and 6 foot 1

but can run 1.5 miles in 11 minutes and do the sit ups and push ups. was told I had to get to ideal weight before allowed to go to ams!

any thoughts let me know

[Guest EZ206PILOT]

Thanks for the information everyone. I actually was ok with my weight for my physical. However they are still and will continue to use the height and weight chart for quite sometime, according to the medical personnel at McChord.

[Toro]

Originally posted by Lightninbo:

where did you hear this and when is it implemented..... was told a couple months ago that I was over weight at 215 and 6 foot 1

but can run 1.5 miles in 11 minutes and do the sit ups and push ups. was told I had to get to ideal weight before allowed to go to ams!

any thoughts let me know

You are exactly the reason why the AF fitness tests are ridiculous (though getting better). You can't measure a person's fitness strictly by how tall and heavy he is, and the bike test they used was ridiculous - daily runners were failing it, and couch potatoes were passing it. Okay, rant aside-

The fitness test is AF wide - it was implemented by CSAF General Jumper. I don't know about other commands, but it has been a huge spotlight under the USAFE commander. This new fitness test takes effect on 1 Jan 04. The policy here is that if you were due for your ergo (bike) test prior to that time, you could delay and do the new fitness test (but if you're out of shape it acutally behooves you to do the bike test since it's easier). Anybody due after the first will do the new test.

As to the weight issue, there may still be some clauses associated with AMS, but once you're doing this on an annual basis, the Max Allowable Weight is not an issue.

[Guest Lightninbo]

thanks toro

[Guest Country Pilot]

I was selected as an alternate to a Guard unit several months ago. Thus, I've had to fill out all the forms and documents required for an ANG pilot appointment. However, I still haven't taken the physical for AF Fm 422. I'm 6'3 and 238 pounds. I'm in good shape and my weight is mostly from my bulk, but I could stand to lose some of my gut. Otherwise, I have no other health problems that would be a problem. I'm simply over-weight by about 15 pounds. I'm dieting and running to get down, but the next board is coming up soon and I want to demonstrate that my health is great. But, I don't think I can lose the weight before then.

Should I just take the physical and be overweight, but pass everything else?

OR

Should I not take the physical until I'm under-weight

Finally, is being over-weight so early in the process bad? I don't want to show any red flags.

Thanks to everyone on this sight! Baseops has been a huge help to me!

[Guest F16PilotMD]

The weight management program changes about every month it seems. Fortunately for me, it's not a medical program so I don't have to worry about it too much. As I last heard it this week, the ANG is changing to a fitness test which includes a timed run, sit-ups, push-ups, flexibility test, and waist measurement. Each is scored independently and the combined score is what matters. I THINK this is designed to catch all bad things: fat, weak, in poor shape, etc....and allow for people who are like you: in good shape just heavier than average for height.

The best thing to do is ask the medical facility who will do your IFC-I physical. They will know. Some units have Commander's policy on this issue as well.

[Guest qbert]

I have been trying for a few months to drop below my max allowable weight. No matter what I have done, I still seem to be overweight. I begin UPT in several weeks and am wondering what to expect as far as inprocessing and stuff. I know I will probably get taped but am also curious as to if I will be allowed through academics but held back from flying if I can't make weight. I am 6' but weight about 215. Does anyone have any information about what I can do or what to expect in regards to leaving my Guard unit and PCSing to my new home? I have also seen people mention the "fat-boy program" but have heard that it has gone away. Anyone know the truth.

[ripster]

how did you get passed the initial physical at MEPS or brooks?

I have to get one soon before I submit my package for AD and I am 210 for a 205 max allowable. It is like two weeks away I am hoping and I am starting to knock the weight down. I can do 6 or 7 pounds by then Im sure. If not then my recruiter wont send me to MEPs for the initial eye, ear physical.

What have you tried? If you are drinking sodas, drink water. If you arent running, start running.

[M2]

Diet and exercise, everything else is just a fad...

The fitness program reg is AFI 10-248 (I think), you can download it at the Air Force reg page. I can't access it now due to my hack-filled Belgian ISP, but I was just looking at it today as we were having a similar discussion at work.

There are two "failures," and depending on how bad you fail you will be enrolled in two separate programs. I used to administer the weight management program while a commander, and as long as you made progress within the standards (I think it was a pound a week, something like that but don't quote me as I always check the regs when administering them), you were fine. However, it only takes a few failures to make progress to initiate discharge.

In my experience the biggest problem with folks, other than those who just didn't care, was they tried a fad diet or some other extreme. It doesn't work, sorry. Adkins and all those have drawbacks, and if you don't exercise you won't make the required progress. The Health and Wellness Center (HAWC) provided all the guidance a person needed, if you can contact them I highly recommend it.

I hate to tack this on but I never had anyone survive the weight management program once they started to not make progress standards. Maybe the ding was too much for them, but once they got their first one each and every one of them ended up going out the gate. Unfortunately that included a lot of good people who otherwise had good careers, but the fitness program is no different than any other requirements in the USAF...either you meet them or you get out. That may be brutal but it is a fact of life...

Good luck, a positive attitude is the first and foremost requirement for beating this!

Cheers! M2

[Guest goirishgo]

Originally posted by flynhigh:

NO! Waste... I mean waist measurement is 30 percent of your "Physical Fitness" test. There is also a Body Mass Index that uses this waste measurement along with your height.

Yeah I know that the waist is 30%, but the BMI system is by no means accurate. You can still have a waist that is well within limits, but a lot of muscle mass can put you over your MAW. Muscle weighs more than fat does.

I've been on active duty now since July and taken the fitness test, but have not been weighed in. So that leads me to believe that it's your fitness test score that really matters. Correct me if I'm wrong..

[Guest chaw]

Diet and exercise. Diet and exercise. Diet and exercise.

I am right under my max allowable weight and going down. You should eat approximately 5-6 times a day, low-sodium and low-sugar. If you are running, then you shouldn't worry so much about low-fat, because you need the energy. I eat 1 bowl of cereal in the morning (6:15), one piece of fruit at ~ 8:00, another piece of fruit around 10:00. Lunch is at 11:00, I generally get a grilled chicken sandwich w/out mayo and a side salad with light/low-fat dressing and diet soda. I eat a small tupperware dish of baby carrots at ~ 1:00, then some trail mix ~ 2:30. Dinner is usually chicken, pork, or fish with vegetables or salad. Eat nothing after dinner. I run 3 miles at a 10 minute mile MWF after work and play tennis on Thursday evenings. I have been on the running schedule since the end of August and had not lost any "weight" until this week, I'm down 2lbs. (I weigh myself both in the morning and the evening every day). I started my "dieting" two weeks ago. For me it was the fast food, I was taking in over 5000 calories a week because I go out to lunch every day. I still go out to lunch every day, but I take in something along the lines of 2000 calories a week just by eating a grilled chicken sandwich instead of a burger and a side-salad instead of fries.

[Guest deweygcc]

I fyou want to lose 10 pounds, dont drink anything but water.

you will drop 5-10 pounds in a week. Its all water, but may get you close.

Eat 1500 calories and fill up with water to help the hunger pains. If you cant sleep cuz ur hungry drink a glass of skim milk before bed. It has enough protien to make your body THINK it has food.

You will lose weight. I highly recommend terminating this as soon as you weigh in.

I was able to save about 4 people in 4 days as far as USAF weight standards go. At OTS in one example I had 4 days to get a guy to lose 10 pounds he got his commission with his class. Im not a trainer or whatever but I can work the body for a few days.

If you are hosed and coming close to the day,

Eat TUNA and NO CARBS. Drink a protien shake for breakfast... and JUST the powder protien. Like the 20 gram in a scoop deal. IF you are hungry during the day drink another. Only do the no carb no fat thing for 2-3 days MAX. You will dump weight fast.

[ 12. October 2004, 21:12: Message edited by: deweygcc ]

[Guest qbert]

I have been running and lifting for a while. I have found that if I try to restrict certain foods, I become really weak or lightheaded. During the PFT I took 6 months ago when commissioned, I ran a 10:08 1.5 mile, 56 pushups and 54 situps in 2 minutes. When I left there, I did get taped and all was fine. I know as well as anybody that it takes a lot of hard work to attain the goals, but I am just curious if there were any more ideas floating around besides the normal run, diet, don't eat junk...etc.

[M2]

AFI 10-248 implements Air Force Policy Directive (AFPD) 10-2, Readiness, and supersedes all guidance provided in AFI 40-501, Air Force Fitness Program and AFI 40-502, The Weight and Body Fat Management Program.

So all you need is 10-248...

Cheers! M2

[Guest goirishgo]

What the good Major is saying is that the new fitness test is the standard for fitness assessment.

With regards to the height/weight the reg says:

4.3.2. Body Composition Assessment.

4.3.2.1. Height and Weight.

4.3.2.1.1. Obtain height and weight IAW DoDI 1308.3 and procedures provided in Attachment

7. These measures are not part of the member’s composite score.

4.3.2.1.2. Members who have a Body Mass Index (BMI) <19 kg/m2 will be referred to their

provider for medical evaluation when first detected. Attachment 7 contains the Body Mass

Index calculation and reference chart.

4.3.2.2. Abdominal Circumference Assessment.

4.3.2.2.1. The abdominal circumference measurement is used to obtain the body composition

component score.

4.3.2.2.2. Abdominal measurement technique is outlined in Attachment 7.

Thanks for the ref, M2. I'm glad we could give qbert the guidance on what he has to do.

[Skitzo]

I found calorie counting worked best for me. That and keeping a food journal. Cut out the soda and limit alcohol and do aerobic excercise.

On another note, do it now because once you get into pilot training it will be really hard to eat right and excercise enough.

[ripster]

All weight reqs just dropped three pounds as of this morning I was told. I am 6'00 tall and it was MAW of 205 now for next boards it is 202. So I have to drop a few before I got into MEPs for the initial physical. So you may want to find out if you have to adhere to the new weight requirements.