Boom Operator Q&A

[Guest]

I am also an ATP rated 4500 hour pilot with 5 type ratings

Holy shit, that's impressive. Seriously. It is especially impressive that you have twice as much time as a civilian pilot as you do as an enlisted aircrew member.

That said...he's asking if being a boom operator will help him in UPT. Have you been to USAF UPT?

My previous ANG squadron looked at the enlisted flyers when it came to UPT with great results.

Big difference between the success in the Guard selection process for UPT and success in UPT based on your experience as a boom operator.

We hired 75+% of our UPT candidates from within. It just made sense...and still does. I still recommend it to people.

I didn't get the vibe he was joining that unit to eventually become a pilot in that unit. I think he intended to get school paid for and then go to UPT and fly something other than a tanker.

+ anyone who disregards the comments of a crew member, enlisted or commissioned, is not worth their weight on the Form-F. I have seen countless times where the FE/LM/AG broke the error chain. I have also seen pilots ignore their enlisted folks with marginal results. It is a crew airplane for a reason.

All I see are comments about enlisted crew members saving the day in spite of a fucked up pilot or two. Just curious, have you ever seen an enlisted crew member make a totally SA dumping extraneous comment that actually fucks the crew up?

The types that thought that since they were pilots, nothing else mattered, were usually the lamest crew members and scheduled around. You wanna be that guy/gal...knock yourself out.

Uh, so?

Anyone schedue around enlisted aircrew or are they all 100% good to fucking go?

No enlisted aircrew with giant fucking chips on their shoulders or constantly gross and sweaty or super obnoxious or just plain shitty that could compete for "the lamest crewmember" slot or was it only pilots?

Just to clarify the sample size you're using for the "lamest crew member" comment, how many USAF units have you been in, ?

SARCASM SPOILER ALERT:

Now, please don't take any of this too seriously or the wrong way. I respect your qualification(s) as a pilot and the important shit you do in the air both as a civilian and as a USAF aircrew member. Just putting a couple things in perspective, albeit in a rather obnoxious way...mostly for effect.

[stract]

I only have a two year degree. Officers require a Bachelors.

if you get hired by a unit and attend AMS, you are only required to complete your degree within 7 years of commissioning. You don't have to start with a degree if you go this route.

[Marco]

It's 5 years now, and most units require a bachelors for an off the street candidate. If you're in-house, a lot will allow you to be within a year of graduation with a minimum of 90 semester hours already completed. The era of the complete college after flight school days are pretty much over.

[Learjetter]

Holy shit, that's impressive. Seriously. ....STD RAINMAN SARCASM/RHETORICAL QUESTIONS/OPINION....

SARCASM SPOILER ALERT:

Now, please don't take any of this too seriously or the wrong way. I respect your qualification(s) as a pilot and the important shit you do in the air both as a civilian and as a USAF aircrew member. Just putting a couple things in perspective, albeit in a rather obnoxious way...mostly for effect.

Holy pulled-punches, Rainman...you lay off the single-malt today?

[Junglejett]

Holy shit, that's impressive. Seriously. It is especially impressive that you have twice as much time as a civilian pilot as you do as an enlisted aircrew member.

Not bad considering I have flown professionally for nearly as long as I have been enlisted aircrew.

That said...he's asking if being a boom operator will help him in UPT. Have you been to USAF UPT?

No I have not been to UPT. But most that were enlisted aircrew and went, said their previous experience helped with the overall process. Ever been enlisted aircrew...I am guessing no.

Big difference between the success in the Guard selection process for UPT and success in UPT based on your experience as a boom operator.

Sure...so is success at UPT totally based on flying ability and not attitude? So if you go in with a shit attitude but great hands, are you going to succeed?

I didn't get the vibe he was joining that unit to eventually become a pilot in that unit. I think he intended to get school paid for and then go to UPT and fly something other than a tanker.

I still think his experience will assist.

All I see are comments about enlisted crew members saving the day in spite of a ######ed up pilot or two. Just curious, have you ever seen an enlisted crew member make a totally SA dumping extraneous comment that actually ######s the crew up?

I have seen plenty on both sides but a crew that respects the abilities of each member is a better crew. Proven. That is where being a pilot has helped me, I know when to speak up and when to STFU. I have also been in the low level environment with a pilot talking about the percentage of corn used in the production of tacos and tortillas. (I am serious) It goes both ways..again, a good crew is one that works TOGETHER and has shared SA. If you want to run your crew in a manner which does not promote communication, have at it.

Uh, so?

Anyone schedue around enlisted aircrew or are they all 100% good to ######ing go?

Sure...again, it goes both ways. It seems your wings are drooping a little. It will be ok. You are still a pilot.

No enlisted aircrew with giant ######ing chips on their shoulders or constantly gross and sweaty or super obnoxious or just plain shitty that could compete for "the lamest crewmember" slot or was it only pilots?

Again, both ways. Problem is, the AC leads the crew, and if he/she is a shitbag, sort of screws the whole mix up. Get it? How much time in multicrew military airplane do you have?

Just to clarify the sample size you're using for the "lamest crew member" comment, how many USAF units have you been in, ?

Two...but have flown with a dozen different units. I have flown with AD, Guard, Reserve. I have seen plenty.

SARCASM SPOILER ALERT:

Now, please don't take any of this too seriously or the wrong way. I respect your qualification(s) as a pilot and the important shit you do in the air both as a civilian and as a USAF aircrew member. Just putting a couple things in perspective, albeit in a rather obnoxious way...mostly for effect.

I never take pilots seriously..especially when they have over inflated egos. ;)

Edited September 29, 2011 by Junglejett

[GBock]

All I see are comments about enlisted crew members saving the day in spite of a ######ed up pilot or two. Just curious, have you ever seen an enlisted crew member make a totally SA dumping extraneous comment that actually ######s the crew up?

[JPStryker]

Hate to burst your bubble, but UPT is a great equalizer. Previous experience, regardless of the type and amount, don't count for shit. My class had prior navs, CFIIs, enlisted aircrew, you name it...Guess what? Didn't have any bearing on performance. It's all about desire, hard work, and innate ability.

[Guest]

Hate to burst your bubble, but UPT is a great equalizer. Previous experience, regardless of the type and amount, don't count for shit. My class had prior navs, CFIIs, enlisted aircrew, you name it...Guess what? Didn't have any bearing on performance. It's all about desire, hard work, and innate ability.

Shack.

Not bad considering I have flown professionally for nearly as long as I have been enlisted aircrew.

That's what I said.

Ever been enlisted aircrew...I am guessing no.

You are guessing right.

Sure...so is success at UPT totally based on flying ability and not attitude? So if you go in with a shit attitude but great hands, are you going to succeed?

Huh?

I'm talking about the difference between the Guard selection process for selecting UPT candidates and actually succeeding in UPT.

The Guard selecetion process favors enlisted crewmembers becuase the Guard selects pilots in a completely different way than the AD AF does.

I have also been in the low level environment with a pilot talking about the percentage of corn used in the production of tacos and tortillas. (I am serious)

OMG!

Sure...again, it goes both ways.

But you were only talking about pilots. So it is not a pilot issue, it is an personal issue.

How much time in multicrew military airplane do you have?

1500 hrs. And I have been through UPT twice and seen guys of a wide range of experience that had no bearing on their performance.

So...in spite of me asking you not to take this personally, you did.

[Guest]

Hate to burst your bubble, but UPT is a great equalizer. Previous experience, regardless of the type and amount, don't count for shit. My class had prior navs, CFIIs, enlisted aircrew, you name it...Guess what? Didn't have any bearing on performance.

Shack.

Not bad considering I have flown professionally for nearly as long as I have been enlisted aircrew.

That's what I said.

Ever been enlisted aircrew...I am guessing no.

You are guessing right.

Sure...so is success at UPT totally based on flying ability and not attitude? So if you go in with a shit attitude but great hands, are you going to succeed?

Huh?

I'm talking about the difference between the Guard selection process for selecting UPT candidates and actually succeeding in UPT.

The Guard selecetion process favors enlisted crewmembers becuase the Guard selects pilots in a completely different way than the AD AF does.

I have also been in the low level environment with a pilot talking about the percentage of corn used in the production of tacos and tortillas. (I am serious)

OMG!

Sure...again, it goes both ways.

But you were only talking about pilots. So it is not a pilot issue, it is an personal issue.

How much time in multicrew military airplane do you have?

1500 hrs. And I have been through UPT twice and seen guys with a wide range of experience and that experience had no bearing on their performance. I have seen guys with several thousand hours wash out of UPT and guys with 0.0 hr kick the shit out of UPT.

So...in spite of me asking you not to take this personally, you did.

[daays]

Just got notification yesterday that my retraining package was approved, and I'll be heading to boom training some time in the future. I've been searching through various forums for info even before I got selected, and being vehicle ops right now, I've had the opportunity to speak to many -135 crews (haven't come across a KC-10 crew yet.) If the cards fall in my favor, I'd prefer KC-10s out of McGuire based soley on the fact that my wife is from PA and I'd like her to be close to family if I'm going to be on the road a lot. The downside to -10s would be two assignment choices, but I'm just happy to have the opportunity to fly finally. Any advice for a married SrA with a daughter on the way? I know this job isn't exactly as family friendly as what I'm doing right now, but I didn't join the AF to drive a bus.

Edited April 3, 2012 by daays

[Guest]

I'd prefer KC-10s out of McGuire based soley on the fact that my wife is from PA and I'd like her to be close to family if I'm going to be on the road a lot.

...but I'm just happy to have the opportunity to fly finally.

I know this job isn't exactly as family friendly as what I'm doing right now, but I didn't join the AF to drive a bus.

It sounds like you have the right attitude and focus on your family to do well and be happy anywhere.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Rainman A-10

[Majestik Møøse]

You. Want. KC-10s.

[B.M.]

If the cards fall in my favor, I'd prefer KC-10s out of McGuire based soley on the fact that my wife is from PA and I'd like her to be close to family if I'm going to be on the road a lot. The downside to -10s would be two assignment choices, but I'm just happy to have the opportunity to fly finally.

McGuire sounds like it might be a great choice: The sandbox won't go away with the A-stan drawdown, and your wife will need all the support she can get with you being away as often as you WILL be.

Good luck!

[daays]

Well I guess the genius at retraining told me the wrong AFSC. Got an email from the CEA pipeline manager today about my deployed status and tech school dates, and in it he said I'm going flight engineer. I'm happy with that 'cause I still got picked up on my first board. It opens up more airframe choices, but I'm still shooting for KC-10s out of McGuire or Travis as my number one. Or C-5s out of Dover. But thanks for your words guys, I appreciate it.

[Champ Kind]

Herks. Do it.

[Techsan]

Well I guess the genius at retraining told me the wrong AFSC. Got an email from the CEA pipeline manager today about my deployed status and tech school dates, and in it he said I'm going flight engineer. I'm happy with that 'cause I still got picked up on my first board. It opens up more airframe choices, but I'm still shooting for KC-10s out of McGuire or Travis as my number one. Or C-5s out of Dover. But thanks for your words guys, I appreciate it.

10s @ Travis...THE only way to go!

[uhhello]

60's if you got the balls

[Biff_T]

Hate to burst your bubble, but UPT is a great equalizer. Previous experience, regardless of the type and amount, don't count for shit. My class had prior navs, CFIIs, enlisted aircrew, you name it...Guess what? Didn't have any bearing on performance. It's all about desire, hard work, and innate ability.

I spent 10 years enlisted (sheet metal/boom operator) and thought that I would destroy the non-priors when I walked into UPT, I was wrong! Flying an aircraft is harder than it looks. The quote mentioned above is right on point. UPT is a place where you can't ###### around. The competition is fierce and no one gives a ###### about what you did before.... Do your best and hope the cards line up in your favor!

[KC45boom]

Is it worth becoming a Boomer? absolutely Yes. I spent 26 years on active duty as a boomer, 13 years in the 135 A /R models and 13 years on the KC-10. I loved every second of it, the job was challenging  and rewarding and definitely not boring.  The boom operator is in integral part of any tanker crew, he is expected to be a system expert in air refueling, Cargo, and passenger handling,. Not sure of the current mission tasking, but in my experience I got to see world, which in itself is an education. I have continued to Fly after retirement and helped develop the KC-30 (A330-MRTT), which has 60 confirmed orders with 9 different clients. The new term is ARO Air Refueling Operator. There is also some interesting opportunities on the horizon for Boom Operators/ARO´s to preform Air Refueling as civilians in support of TRANSCOM/AMC  through Contract Air Refueling. 

[Sim]

On 2/27/2020 at 3:47 AM, KC45boom said:

TRANSCOM/AMC  through Contract Air Refueling. 

...go on.  Other than Omega, is there another venture? 

[Sua Sponte]

On 2/29/2020 at 7:30 AM, Sim said:

...go on.  Other than Omega, is there another venture? 

Friend of mine made bank flying on the UAE KC-30 for a few years before taking a -46 LTS sim instructor job.